Received: by alpheratz.cpm.aca.mmu.ac.uk id UAA27354 (8.6.9/5.3[ref pg@gmsl.co.uk] for cpm.aca.mmu.ac.uk from fmb-majordomo@mmu.ac.uk); Mon, 14 Aug 2000 20:16:04 +0100 Message-ID: <000c01c00627$fba8aa80$200fbed4@default> From: "Kenneth Van Oost" <Kenneth.Van.Oost@village.uunet.be> To: "memetics" <memetics@mmu.ac.uk> Subject: Changing threads/ American Nationalism !? Date: Mon, 14 Aug 2000 21:43:09 +0200 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0007_01C00638.A3972220" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 Sender: fmb-majordomo@mmu.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: memetics@mmu.ac.uk
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Vincent,
Glad to hear that there is nothing wrong with yours and mine connection to
the list. So will speed up the discussion, the trail as you called about...
Your last post did ring a bell, it is an issue which is not only seen in England
or in Amerca. One of the major problems with an united Europe is that despite
all the borders seem gone, that new borders are created.
That is, what politicians here in Belgium call, an Europe of Regions, for example,
Flanders, and in England, f. e. Dorchester_ the notion of the nation is outstripped.
But, like you mentioned in your post, like in America those regions will fall
apart aswell, that is Flanders will split into the region round Antwerp, Ghent,
etc, that due minor cultural and language differences.
These differences are already there, like people from Antwerp are not so
tolerant as people in Ghent towards immigrants, that due that Antwerp has a
greater harbor...f.e. The behaviour of people of Antwerp is different of that of me,
living in Ghent, as a product of the history of the city, ( remerber Imperor Charles
V and what he did towards the people of Ghent) well that knowledge is still in-
side me...I am more of a rebel, I will opposite intolerance.
Of course, not all of the people of Ghent are like that, but anyway, if you walk
down the streets of cities like Ghent, Brussels, Antwerp, London, Manchester,...
you have the feeling that they are all different. It is that feeling you have to catch,
to make a common notion of city- hood or in that respect nation- hood.
That is why, I suppose the notion of britishness is increasingly challenged, your
towns are changing due the large communities of immigrants. The fact that Eng-
land once was an empire, and so had a nation- hood like notion, increases the
process_you all have the feeling you are loosing something (nation-hood)
where in fact England becomes more divers and in fact more region- like
If that is a good point I don 't know, but in order to re-stage the nation- hood-
feeling, I think you have to find a point where the mixure of cultures can conjoin_
something like the pain after Lady Di died...
Such situations can give a nation a notion of nation- hood ,but the problem with
such things is that they don 't last for long. Rebuilding nation- hood- like be-
haviour is IMHO not possible, due, not only through social causes, but also by
memetic/ genetic causes. The fact alone of individuality gives a nation a hard
blow...
Language problems, like here in Belgium or like in Canada devides nations and
peoples...
Religion is another, and I susepct there are more...
That 's it for now...
By the way, Vincent, there is a program currently running on BBC World, called "Creation, science friction the historical struggle between the belief system of
religion and science ". Saturday 12 August was the first episode, next Saturday,
I think the second. Check that out, it is really interesting to watch how religion
influences American thought. Very strange, indeed !!
Also, relevant to that program check out, Lamarckism in American thought, that is
at www.hcc.hawaii.edu, you can link from there to Deviancy Lamarckism.
The reason for that is that those pages give a better insight in what happens in
American society, the contrast between Lamarckism and Darwinism clarifies
a lot though.
Best wishes,
Kenneth
( I am, because we are)
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