From: Van oost Kenneth (kennethvanoost@belgacom.net)
Date: Sun 24 Nov 2002 - 10:53:47 GMT
----- Original Message -----
From: <joedees@bellsouth.net>
> The US does not want to rule other countries; it just wants their peoples
> to be free to form them and democratically choose their leaders on a
> regular basis, and believes that, if this is the case, that their
populaces,
> out of the conjunction of self-interest and economic interdependence,
> will learn how to play fairly and well together, and will direct their
> respective governmental representatives to do the same (much as
> Europe has).
This made my hair stand one way ! ( And I got a lot...)
I ain 't gonna in discussion with you Joe about this or for the whole the
thread for that matter, but this is my personal, though European view,
and IMO you are wrong, completely wrong !
You really don 't understand !
IMO, you're equal worse to what you reproach us or the Radical Islam !
You are biased, as communism and fascism in the past, in the notion that
one other interpretation is no due !
You have a take on democracy, like I always suspected you have, that
comes close to what is a " religious belief ". Freedom, equality, tolerance
and whatever are the tokens of your belief, democracy is your monotheistic
God ! With that you exclude any other possible take on what is reality out
there in the real world. The real world is Joe, that Radical Islam oppose
your American views and you can 't simply have that !
You interpretate history like it is American due, Bush on 9/ 11 noticed
that the war against terrorism was the only way for America to come in
the clear with its own 200 year old faith_ its devine destiny....
Bush and other American presidents are Gods own representatives on the
democratic earth where the Pope is for Christianity.
From that moment on, the whole set of what is the worlds reality made
room from only one memeset, that of America. Oh, but that process
is since a long time underway, though, from the moment on the US was
founded, Americans made for themselves clear that upon their religious
bias of creatonism they will make the world a better place.
And that notion works thru' everything you do, you want still to
create, the US wants to create a world according to its own old
fashion religious views and the US can't stand that other peoples
are not that keen on that prospect.
But Joe, it is not Islam that is to blame, but indeed Radical Islam
or what is known as the Political Islam.
That is not a thing of Islam itself but also a product of the Western
world_ you seem to ignore the fact that within the Western world
the notion of Good opposites Evil and this notion changed over the
years and ended up in Pluralism and Democracy.
Yet you fail to feel that Khomeini and bin Laden are just such
Western figures as Hitler was one, they too set up a political/
religious system wherein good opposites Evil with no inbetweens.
You still cling on to that opposite view of Good and Evil !
To go to battle Islam uses the Koran, America uses an alledged
notion that peoples wants to be free, the US uses Democracy !
But in both cases the use is political biased, and therefor you use
it as an anti- political system, you dismiss the differences and let
that be now just what democracy is all about ! damn....
The US, and Islam too, wants to dismiss any other political inter-
pretation, for Islam it is faith, for the US it is freedom but bang
me to the wall, it is equal religious at its bias!
And moreover Joe, God Bless America is one of the US its
religious tokens. The US have made God subordinate to the
American constitution_ America's belief in its own destiny
is written within its own constitution, there is no seperation
of religion and politics like in any other lay- nation in Europe,
you simply have given god a legal place in your mids.
Read the Koran and you will find that for Gods sake, America
is Mohammed own little paradise, everything what Islam stands
for can be found in America.... Ironic isn 't it that Americans
submit themselves to their constitution and in the same token
you fight a religion that has the same principle underneath !
The country itself was based by refugees who were prosecuted
and repressed by the ignorants of Europe.
The real difference and thus why, IMO Europe is so contrary
is that Americans submit themselves to the constitution which
is in my view totally religious biased, where in Europe the re-
ligious (f)actors were slowly removed and replaced by a more
open memeset.
The US still think that history is there to be made, and that is a
very dangerous evolution_ but that is also the only way along
which the US can develop if its hold on to its constitution....
If America continues it will not only loose itself but also Europe
will opposite in the end. Don 't loose the only friend you have....
That is my opinion,
Kenneth
( with a little help of Afshin Ellian,
a Irani poët and philosopher )
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