Received: by alpheratz.cpm.aca.mmu.ac.uk id BAA03543 (8.6.9/5.3[ref pg@gmsl.co.uk] for cpm.aca.mmu.ac.uk from fmb-majordomo@mmu.ac.uk); Sat, 10 Feb 2001 01:34:54 GMT From: "Lawrence DeBivort" <debivort@umd5.umd.edu> To: <memetics@mmu.ac.uk> Subject: RE: Darwinian evolution vs memetic evolution Date: Fri, 9 Feb 2001 19:07:28 -0500 Message-ID: <NEBBKOADILIOKGDJLPMAKEMMCAAA.debivort@umd5.umd.edu> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <F147lN7SIt865WYtn4y000041a2@hotmail.com> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 Sender: fmb-majordomo@mmu.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: memetics@mmu.ac.uk
From: Scott Chase
>LdB:
>
>I like your animation metaphor: one of the measures of the success of the
>meme is the fidelity with which the successive copies are made.
SCott:
Here we go with the analogies again. Words like "mutant" and "hybrid"
suggest something akin to genetic phenomena. "Fidelity" and "copy" suggests
that there is something atomizable.
At least with genes one can make comparisons between sequences at the
genetic level or in some instances compare discrete effects at the
phenotypic level. One can even look at relationships of dominance and
recessiveness or construct a Punnett square.
How does one compare "memes" to establish a percentage of similarity or
copying fidelity or are these just hopeful analogies? Can we establish a
mutation rate for "memes"?
Do "memes" evolve by duplication and divergence?
LdB:
It is not difficult to specify/identify the structure of a meme
linguistically, and then track that structure as the meme spreads,
monitoring whether the structure remains the same or changes as it goes
through each step of the dissemination. I'm not sure this structure has the
degree of resolution of that of a gene, but in my experience it is
sufficient for memetic tracking. So, yes, fidelity can be tracked, as can a
meme's pattern of change during dissemination in a population.
I think a single mutation 'rate' might be established for a meme, but this
requires some formula that would capture the relationship among the parts of
the structure of the meme, and I have not tried to do this, as my interest
is in how the elements of the structure change. Different parts might mutate
at different rates, for example, and a composite mutation rate may be of
less interest than what is happening to the parts.
Has anyone on this list tried establishing a composite mutation rate for a
meme? Any success?
- Lawrence
_________________________________________________________________
Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com
===============================================================
This was distributed via the memetics list associated with the
Journal of Memetics - Evolutionary Models of Information Transmission
For information about the journal and the list (e.g. unsubscribing)
see: http://www.cpm.mmu.ac.uk/jom-emit
===============================================================
This was distributed via the memetics list associated with the
Journal of Memetics - Evolutionary Models of Information Transmission
For information about the journal and the list (e.g. unsubscribing)
see: http://www.cpm.mmu.ac.uk/jom-emit
This archive was generated by hypermail 2b29 : Sat Feb 10 2001 - 01:36:59 GMT