Received: by alpheratz.cpm.aca.mmu.ac.uk id JAA04927 (8.6.9/5.3[ref pg@gmsl.co.uk] for cpm.aca.mmu.ac.uk from fmb-majordomo@mmu.ac.uk); Thu, 1 Jun 2000 09:01:59 +0100 Message-ID: <20000601075926.69884.qmail@hotmail.com> X-Originating-IP: [212.140.124.18] From: "Paul marsden" <paulsmarsden@hotmail.com> To: memetics@mmu.ac.uk Subject: Re: Cui Bono Chuck? Date: Thu, 01 Jun 2000 00:59:26 PDT Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Sender: fmb-majordomo@mmu.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: memetics@mmu.ac.uk
Sorry original got garbled...
Chuck wrote;
It looks to me -- and many others --
like a belief in gremlins. In fact many reviewers say that the Blackmore's
latest book makes excellent reading if seen as science fiction. The answers
I
have recieved so far are: 1) don't worry about it because it's only a
rhetorical
device to get people to think about how they behave, 2) memics isn't a
science
anyway, but a point of view, and 3) memics makes excellent predictions
(although
the particulars are always left out). The problem with these answers is that
memics is posing as a science by borrowing the gene metaphor. And if you
look at
some of the posts carefully, most people here are taking the metaphor far
more
seriously than just another point of view.
There are many ways to assess the goodness of a model, but objective
ontological truth is not one of them
What I suggest memetics brings to the table is insight into cultural
dynamics that can be gained, not just by focusing at the level of the
individual (psychology) or the group (sociology), but also the level of
cultural instructions (as one conceptualisation of information) themselves
(memetics) – a concrete example is the account of suicide I offered. Indeed
the reflexive nature of cultural groups/meme (groups may be defined in terms
of memes) provides a model to account for cultural group selection without
the reification of the group (a la Durkheim)
A good practical example of the potential power of memetics is If Price’s
book – Shifting the Patterns – that takes a meme’s eye view of
organisations; although I had problems with the precise operationalisation
of the meme concept – the book provides an insightful memetic stance into
corporate life.
Another good example is Richard Brodie’s Virus of the Mind, which provides a
meme-eye level reworking of the social influence literature providing new
insight into an old subject
And Aaron Lynch’s Thought Contagion provides a sweeping tour of the
potential power of memetics – although he and I may disagree (sometimes
quite publicly) on the details of how a memetic stance might be
operationalised and memetics made progressive, Aaron demonstrates the power
of memetics to generate interesting research hypotheses not intuitively
available when culture is viewed exclusively from group/individual levels.
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