Received: by alpheratz.cpm.aca.mmu.ac.uk id FAA16572 (8.6.9/5.3[ref pg@gmsl.co.uk] for cpm.aca.mmu.ac.uk from fmb-bounces@mmu.ac.uk); Fri, 28 Sep 2001 05:23:55 +0100 X-Originating-IP: [209.240.222.132] From: "Scott Chase" <ecphoric@hotmail.com> To: memetics@mmu.ac.uk Subject: RE: state of memes Date: Fri, 28 Sep 2001 00:19:00 -0400 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: <F18n0yjOEeN0kCLBjTa00002fda@hotmail.com> X-OriginalArrivalTime: 28 Sep 2001 04:19:00.0623 (UTC) FILETIME=[B31521F0:01C147D4] Sender: fmb-bounces@mmu.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: memetics@mmu.ac.uk
>From: "Lawrence DeBivort" <debivort@umd5.umd.edu>
>Reply-To: memetics@mmu.ac.uk
>To: <memetics@mmu.ac.uk>
>Subject: RE: state of memes
>Date: Thu, 27 Sep 2001 10:49:47 -0400
>
>Kenneth, I agree with your point. Here in Washington, there has been a
>quiet
>effort to raise the WHY question, but it is not a welcome one. The natural
>reason for the resistence to the WHY question is that it leads to some not
>so pleasing conclusions about how the US conducts itself internationally.
>So
>instead some people react to the WHY question by saying 1) that it lays the
>foundation for appeasing terrorists, or 2) that as victims we don't have a
>moral obligation to understand why (that in other words we have a right to
>act irrationally), or 3) that we don't have time for that kind of
>reflection -- we must act now, to protect ourselves from further attack, or
>to punish the perpetrators, etc.
>
>Generally, the tone of discussion in Washington is improving, people are
>calming down, becoming less panicky, and we are beginning to think about
>what happened and what we should do more more intelligently. There is still
>a considerable way to go, and I believe eventually we will begin to
>consider
>WHY. At that point we may see some welcome adjustments to how we conduct
>ourselves internationally. The knee-jerk cowboy response is over; patience
>and carefulness are entering into the debate. I, for one, would welcome
>the
>help of our friends overseas in thinking through the WHY question; we need
>that outside perspective.
>
>
Well the why question isn't too hard.
1. Our (US-ian) presence in Saudi Arabia, happening to contain Mecca and
Medina which are two holy Muslim sites. We had fought a campaign against a
fascist upstart named Hussein who had been gassing Kurds and Iranians and
had decided to flex his newfound muscles on Kuwait. Saudi Arabia is a
strategic location to thump any other attempts by the butcher of Baghdad to
assert himself is it not? Maybe the mujahideen could have done better all by
themselves (sans stealth technology and smart bombs) or maybe they might
have suffered the same gassings handed to the Kurds and Iranians previously.
Whether Husseein should have been removed from power (with a resulting power
vacuum) or whether the U.S. should have continued presence in Saudi Arabia
are debatable, but the recent jihad strikes were unacceptable in regard to
the latter.
2. Our continued support of Israel, who though not all that clean handed wrt
treatment of Palestinians would likely be driven into the Mediterranean if
the Islamicist militants had their druthers.
Aside from casuistric implications resulting from anti-Soviet policies
whereby the U.S. played a hand in aiding the mujahideen and how this may
have helped facilitate the emergence of some of the terrorist networks now
seen across the globe, I think that may about exhaust the *why* unless
someone feels like delving into the history of jihad into medieval Spain and
the crusades.
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