Received: by alpheratz.cpm.aca.mmu.ac.uk id WAA17401 (8.6.9/5.3[ref pg@gmsl.co.uk] for cpm.aca.mmu.ac.uk from fmb-majordomo@mmu.ac.uk); Tue, 1 May 2001 22:37:28 +0100 Message-ID: <20010501213345.12193.qmail@web10106.mail.yahoo.com> Date: Tue, 1 May 2001 14:33:45 -0700 (PDT) From: Trupeljak Ozren <ozren_trupeljak@yahoo.com> Subject: Re: Information To: memetics@mmu.ac.uk In-Reply-To: <20010501211200.AAA29832@camailp.harvard.edu@[205.240.180.42]> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: fmb-majordomo@mmu.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: memetics@mmu.ac.uk
--- "Wade T.Smith" <wade_smith@harvard.edu> wrote:
> Except that I'm not looking to make interpretations, (and I deny that
> I'm
> supplying any). I'm looking to clarify terms. The fact that none of
> the
> definitions offered from any of the sources would satisfy the
> 'computer
> program equals a pattern' statement is sufficient for me to look at
> Robin's meaning of 'pattern' as idiosyncratic, and to look from
> another
> perspective, or to find another word, or to refine that equation
> further.
Ah...OK. So what is your take?
>
> Right now, perhaps, some computer programs can show a pattern of
> ineptitude, and may have patterned elements as part of their makeup,
> or
> may produce patterns from their operation, but, simply calling a
> computer
> program a pattern is insufficient.
Hmm...I still fail to see the significant distinction between the word
"algorithm" (a procedure used to solve a problem)and pattern (for
solving the problem)(in your own words, "A plan, diagram, or model to
be followed in making things.").
And as far as I know, algorithms can be (and are) portrayed as patterns
of relations between sets, fields, objects, etc.. of the computer
program.
Even if you look on the lowest level, you can find patterns of
repetition in the way data is stored in computers, and since all the
programs are basicaly stored in the same way (as 1 and 0 patterns in
registers), you can easily call algorithm a meta-pattern of lower level
patterns. Again, a pattern...
Am I missing something here?
>
> In much the same way calling one grain a pattern of the tipping point
> is.
> The grains are patterned elements of the mound, and geometrically
> will be
> arranged in a three dimensional pattern, and repeating the experiment
> of
> building the mound until avalanche will provide a pattern of data,
> but,
> otherwise, no, I see no equality whatsoever between any of the
> dictionary
> definitions of pattern and the term 'algorithm' (although, nicely,
> rhythm
> is a pattern...), or 'computer program'.
1's and 0's of the computer program are not patterns themselves (OK, if
you go down to the force levels, then yes, they are a pattern in a
specific EM force field, but whatever, that is just being nitpicky),
but the way they are arranged is a pattern. And higher level orderings
of those patterns can also be called patterns. (dictionary meaning 5. A
consistent, characteristic form, style, or method, as: a. A composite
of traits or features characteristic of an individual or a group.(this
is from your own dictionary))
>
> There's at least one adjective missing.
>
> - Wade
>
Which one?
=====
There are very few man - and they are exceptions - who are able to think and feel beyond the present moment.
Carl von Clausewitz
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Auctions - buy the things you want at great prices
http://auctions.yahoo.com/
===============================================================
This was distributed via the memetics list associated with the
Journal of Memetics - Evolutionary Models of Information Transmission
For information about the journal and the list (e.g. unsubscribing)
see: http://www.cpm.mmu.ac.uk/jom-emit
This archive was generated by hypermail 2b29 : Tue May 01 2001 - 22:40:55 BST