Received: by alpheratz.cpm.aca.mmu.ac.uk id TAA09919 (8.6.9/5.3[ref pg@gmsl.co.uk] for cpm.aca.mmu.ac.uk from fmb-majordomo@mmu.ac.uk); Fri, 30 Mar 2001 19:52:48 +0100 From: <joedees@bellsouth.net> To: memetics@mmu.ac.uk Date: Fri, 30 Mar 2001 12:55:05 -0600 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Re: Memetic Paradigms Message-ID: <3AC48229.9444.16BB2D@localhost> In-reply-to: <20010330113622.C1013@reborntechnology.co.uk> References: <200103300013.QAA12658@mail16.bigmailbox.com>; from joedees@addall.com on Thu, Mar 29, 2001 at 04:13:13PM -0800 X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.12c) Sender: fmb-majordomo@mmu.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: memetics@mmu.ac.uk
On 30 Mar 2001, at 11:36, Robin Faichney wrote:
> On Thu, Mar 29, 2001 at 04:13:13PM -0800, Joe Dees wrote:
> > >
> > >On Wed, Mar 28, 2001 at 09:38:25PM -0600, joedees@bellsouth.net
> > >wrote:
> > >> They are not isolable atoms, like genes,
> > >> because their existence includes their relations; memes
> > >> necessarily relate to other memes, and these relations is part
> > >> and parcel of what constitutes the significances of the memes.
> > >
> > >Genes, generally, are highly interdependent too. What proportion
> > >of our genes, do you think, is *directly* concerned with
> > >replicating itself, rather than supporting a cluster, for which a
> > >few will arrange the replication of all?
> > >
> > None, actually. Since genes lack subjectivity, they cannot be said
> > to be concerned with anything.
>
> Deliberate obtuseness impresses nobody, Joe.
>
So why do you continuously employ it?
>
> > The point is that the A G C and T of which genes are comprised are
> > kinda like the letters of the alphabet, or better yet, phonemes;
> > which are combined to represent meanings (words, but even more
> > basic, morphemes), but in and of themselves, they are meaningless.
> > A multiplicity of components are required to configure into an
> > informational pattern. Certain traits that are distinguishable, yet
> > cannot stand on their own separate from others, such as furred-ness,
> > feathered-ness, bipedality, quadrapedality, etc., are comparable to
> > morphemes such as -s or -es for pluralization (or silent, in some
> > cases, like deer), or other prefixes, suffixes and roots (anti-,
> > con- -tion, etc.). They, in turn, are comprised of gene clusters,
> > where specific genes can only perform a function in the context of
> > the gestalt of the cluster, just as phonemes symbolize nothing
> > (except in the cases where a morpheme is comprised of a single
> > phoneme, and perhaps there are gene - gene-cluster analogies here,
> > too) but tepresent the smallest atom of auditorily detectable and
> > palate-constructable speech differentiation from other phonemes,
> > just as the gene elements A G C and T represent the smallest atoms
> > of chromosome differentiation.
>
> In other words, you agree that genes are just as interdependent as
> memes after all. You have done a complete about-face.
>
No, genes are NOT as interdependent as memes. The genes for
brown eyes are not connected whatsoever to male pattern
baldness, yet all meanings, as mutually correlatively defining, are
intertwined in the semiotic web, also referred to as the vicious
hermeneutic circle.
> --
> Robin Faichney
> Get your Meta-Information from http://www.ii01.org
> (CAUTION: contains philosophy, may cause heads to spin)
>
> ===============================================================
> This was distributed via the memetics list associated with the
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>
>
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This was distributed via the memetics list associated with the
Journal of Memetics - Evolutionary Models of Information Transmission
For information about the journal and the list (e.g. unsubscribing)
see: http://www.cpm.mmu.ac.uk/jom-emit
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