RE: Darwinian evolution vs memetic evolution

From: Vincent Campbell (v.p.campbell@stir.ac.uk)
Date: Mon Feb 19 2001 - 14:22:34 GMT

  • Next message: Vincent Campbell: "RE: Darwinian evolution vs memetic evolution"

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    From: Vincent Campbell <v.p.campbell@stir.ac.uk>
    To: "'memetics@mmu.ac.uk'" <memetics@mmu.ac.uk>
    Subject: RE: Darwinian evolution vs memetic evolution
    Date: Mon, 19 Feb 2001 14:22:34 -0000
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    Age-wise, I'm a member of generation x, and I can't say Casablanca quotes
    play as big a part in 'our" lives (I'm not sure there's a genuine
    collectivity there), as, say, quotes from 'Star Wars'....

    Vincent

    > ----------
    > From: Scott Chase
    > Reply To: memetics@mmu.ac.uk
    > Sent: Saturday, February 17, 2001 6:00 pm
    > To: memetics@mmu.ac.uk
    > Subject: Re: Darwinian evolution vs memetic evolution
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
    > >From: Chris Taylor <Christopher.Taylor@man.ac.uk>
    > >Reply-To: memetics@mmu.ac.uk
    > >To: memetics@mmu.ac.uk
    > >Subject: Re: Darwinian evolution vs memetic evolution
    > >Date: Thu, 15 Feb 2001 13:21:02 +0000
    > >
    > > > some blinking asshole said it wrong
    > >
    > >Yeah, that's true, but the 'why did it do so well' part is still
    > >interesting. I think the fact that the selective world is changing very
    > >fast is useful here, because some things survive despite the changes in
    > >circumstances (for instance, 'snafu' is dying out with the generation
    > >who used it, but 'play it again sam' isn't).
    > >
    > I'm trying to think of the last time I heard someone I know use the phrase
    >
    > "play it again Sam". I can't off the top of my head recall this, but as a
    > caveat I don't get out much :-)
    >
    > Has anyone else heard this phrase used? Is it popular within the so-called
    >
    > "Generation X" entity? How prevalent is this phrase amogst various pockets
    >
    > of societies world wide? Any hard data on this?
    >
    > Maybe it was a matter of a non-apadtive change in the phrase from the
    > original being propagated at the expense of accuracy. Why would fitness be
    >
    > necessarily involved or OTOH is fitness sufficient to cover "memetic"
    > phenomena?
    > >
    > >It all comes down to how
    > >effectively the thing (tune, idiom, whatever) taps into the generic
    > >themes of a culture. More generic -> more flexibility of application /
    > >less incompatibilities with resident memes (details) -> higher chance of
    > >long term success.
    > >
    > >
    > I could see how something previously compatible or even neutrally benign
    > might become incompatible with a shift in the "memetic" landscape. The
    > behavior of smoking tobacco in public places has shifted from "cool" or
    > fashionable to downright disgusting or offensive in some circumstances
    > (nice
    > restaraunts), though I still find myself breathing in secondhand smoke in
    > bars or clubs.
    >
    > Nonetheless, I think it a mistake to automatically shoehorn cultural
    > phenomena in analogous references to biological terms such as fitness,
    > heritability &c. BTW what's the story with "&c"? Why is "etc." preferred?
    > _________________________________________________________________
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    >
    > ===============================================================
    > This was distributed via the memetics list associated with the
    > Journal of Memetics - Evolutionary Models of Information Transmission
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    >

    ===============================================================
    This was distributed via the memetics list associated with the
    Journal of Memetics - Evolutionary Models of Information Transmission
    For information about the journal and the list (e.g. unsubscribing)
    see: http://www.cpm.mmu.ac.uk/jom-emit



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