Received: by alpheratz.cpm.aca.mmu.ac.uk id JAA28917 (8.6.9/5.3[ref pg@gmsl.co.uk] for cpm.aca.mmu.ac.uk from fmb-majordomo@mmu.ac.uk); Fri, 9 Feb 2001 09:22:01 GMT Date: Fri, 9 Feb 2001 09:00:44 +0000 To: memetics@mmu.ac.uk Subject: Re: Labels for memes Message-ID: <20010209090044.A1178@reborntechnology.co.uk> References: <20010201091216.B1239@reborntechnology.co.uk> <JJEIIFOCALCJKOFDFAHBIEDDCEAA.richard@brodietech.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.3.12i In-Reply-To: <JJEIIFOCALCJKOFDFAHBIEDDCEAA.richard@brodietech.com>; from richard@brodietech.com on Wed, Feb 07, 2001 at 10:15:11AM -0800 From: Robin Faichney <robin@reborntechnology.co.uk> Sender: fmb-majordomo@mmu.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: memetics@mmu.ac.uk
On Wed, Feb 07, 2001 at 10:15:11AM -0800, Richard Brodie wrote:
> Robin,
>
> I forgot what we were arguing about.
>
> Given your definition of behavior as any kind of information manifested in
> physical reality (an unusual definition?)
I've no idea where you got that. My concept of behaviour is no different
from the one in general use, and probably no different from that of
anyone here. To say that it encodes cultural information is to offer
a particular way of thinking about cultural information (and not a new
way), and says nothing whatsoever about behaviour itself.
> then I think we agree about the
> definition of meme. You want to extend the word to include all the Rube
> Goldberg apparatus that helps it transmit itself to another mind.
All I'm saying is that if we agree the meme is transmitted, then it makes
no sense to envisage some kind of Star Trek type "beaming down", when,
given what we're talking about is information, we can use the concept
of encoding instead. No need for matter transmission when what's being
transmitted ain't matter.
I think maybe you failed to notice, I don't say behaviour or artifacts
are memes, I say they _encode_ memes. Obviously, minds are required
for the decoding.
> I don't
> really have a problem with that as long as we're clear that we're talking
> about mental replicators.
I don't have a problem with that as long as we're clear what we mean by
"mental"... :-)
-- Robin Faichney robin@reborntechnology.co.uk=============================================================== This was distributed via the memetics list associated with the Journal of Memetics - Evolutionary Models of Information Transmission For information about the journal and the list (e.g. unsubscribing) see: http://www.cpm.mmu.ac.uk/jom-emit
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