Re: Religion and evidence/ for Kate

From: Kenneth Van Oost (kennethvanoost@belgacom.net)
Date: Thu 02 Feb 2006 - 20:23:15 GMT

  • Next message: Chris Taylor: "Re: Sticky Memes/ to Chris"

    << I 've tried to post this several times, hope it works now !!

    >
    > ----- Original Message -----
    > From: Kenneth Van Oost <kennethvanoost@belgacom.net>
    > To: <memetics@mmu.ac.uk>
    > Sent: Sunday, January 29, 2006 9:18 PM
    > Subject: Re: Religion and evidence/ for Kate
    >
    >
    > >
    > > ----- Original Message -----
    > > From: Kate Distin <memes@distin.co.uk>
    > > > I was not brought up as a Christian.
    > > > I lived as an atheist for a decade.
    > > > My children know that other people have other faiths, and none.
    > > > I'm sorry that my Christianity makes you so angry. I think you and I
    > > > have to agree to differ about this one. I can't see any point in
    > > > debating it further with you.
    > >
    > > << First, I am not angry, far from it ! He, this is a discussion forum,
    so
    > > when
    > > hard words has to fall- on the other hand though, I 'm surprised about
    > your
    > > reaction ! As it was I attacked you personaly, it was just my way to
    show
    > > how
    > > difficult, how sometimes impossible it will be to learn kids another
    view
    > > about
    > > life/ culture/ society than the one they were brought up in.
    > >
    > > You have to realize that each ideology will try to persuade/ convert as
    > much
    > > people as possible that its views are the right ones and it will try to
    > > squeeze
    > > society into its convictions_ so in a way, even how hard you will try to
    > > learn
    > > your children that indeed other convictions exist and that people live
    by
    > > its
    > > rules, your children will take their learned philosophy into society and
    > > change
    > > it accordingly.
    > >
    > > The problem I got with it all is that you start from the presupposition
    > that
    > > the
    > > human is a social being and not from the modern conviction that he is
    from
    > > his
    > > bias up a pure and simple individual. We ought to say within the context
    > > that
    > > religion has to become more than ever, a private matter.
    > > And that is just what happened_ modern times sees religion, and its
    annex
    > > ' weltanschauung ' as a pure private character. But one conception
     will
    > > try
    > > to) escape(s) from the commend of the private, and that is the belief in
    > the
    > > in-
    > > dividual and the personal character of religious and ideological ideas.
    > > And thus, what else can it be, religion places itself within a
    privileged
    > > position,
    > > one that wants to be general and common. She, religion, justifies this
    > > exception
    > > by declaring that she is the (only) condition by which a society of free
    > > individuals
    > > will/ can be possible.
    > > And that isn 't true !
    > >
    > > We don 't need religion or any other ' belief ' to form ' community ' !
    > > It is not so that when all individuals pursue their own personal
    interest
    > > that they
    > > act egoistic, what they do_ being altruistic, helping people, giving to
    > > charity_ or
    > > not, helps the builiding of society. Humans do NOT act like they were
    homo
    > > homini lupus !! People loose themselves within to help others and endure
    > the
    > > pain of their losses. We don 't need the or any co- ordination ( of
    > > religion) to
    > > act in that way ! We do not longer trust religion, or politics_ any
    system
    > > that
    > > brings out ' community ', just because as the individuals we are_ we
    have
    > > even
    > > privatized our sense of ( giving) trust_ we keep it for those
    > relationships
    > > we see
    > > as worthwhile, and no longer for society/ politics, let stand alone
    > religion
    > > !!
    > >
    > > The main difficulty for many as for you and for your kids I presume is
    > that
    > > you
    > > can 't suppose that we deal here with individuals/ individuality and
    that
    > > then
    > > politics/ the social shows itself as a problem wherefor only a quasi-
    > > religious
    > > solution is the answer.
    > > Modernity should correct this and then, I hope the social/ political
    > > dimension
    > > will be, once again, a natural fact of being human !
    > > Being religious is not !
    > > Where society/ politics or culture for that matter should provide the
    > > answers
    > > for the todays problems where we all faced with, we search into a
    > dimension
    > > which is not part of this world. Transcedention is NOT the answer !!!
    > >
    > > Regards,
    > >
    > > Kenneth
    > >
    > >
    > >
    >

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