From: Van oost Kenneth (kennethvanoost@belgacom.net)
Date: Sat 18 Jan 2003 - 10:57:28 GMT
----- Original Message -----
From: "Philip Jonkers" <philosophimur@dygo.com>
> Keith:
> >While I don't feel the need for an exact definition of a meme, applying
it
> >to an idea that never makes the jump from person to person misses the
> >essence of the concept--at least to me.
Philip,
> I agree, from an evolutionary point of view elements derived from the
self-plex are perhaps the least interesting ones. But from a point of view
of self-consciousness and the development of the ego they are quite
interesting. Also, I think most self-plex memes are being replicated since
we are quite an egalitarian bunch of creatures who all use the same language
to express our ego in. For instance, revelations like "I am good in math" or
"I want to be good in physics" can hardly be called unique.
Hi Phil,
Welcome back,
Maybe we 're an egalitarian bunch, but I don 't really think that we 're all
that equal
as you might presume. Using the same language is a fine example, but the
thing to
remerber is how we use the words, nuances, tricks and treats of that
language in
order to express our ego in.
In the article, the writer called ' the skeleton of a story ' the most
important and
the thing that gets transferred. How people tell the story to another is the
thing
we have to look at.
Bill Benzon does this with music, from Gershwin 's I 've got Rhythm a whole
set of other ' performances ' are derived over the years.
I try to do this with words, ' I ' am good in maths ' can be said in a
thousand
different ways, each of them will have a different outcome in how people
react to it.
What we need is what is suggested, what is explained as non- content- trans-
missions, " that which in a language can be subtle persuasive, and the
way[s],
especially, that words have a deposition on the things they name a trace of
their passage, of leading some of their dust on them, which renders those
things,
as we assimilate them, a little more foreign to us. " ( Céline)
Nothing is expected if we call one a jerk, but it goes anyway without
saying.
No doubt ' intend ' is involved. We fail to see that one's memes might take
our words as they were a threat, an obstruction, as opposite, contorted,
ironic, twisted...
The skeleton ' I 'm good in math ' rests absolute, but not the ways in how
it is said and how people receive the info. And not to mention the
environment,
how is the emotional state, the psychological state, does he understand the
language, etc....
This is a very complex issue.
Regards,
Kenneth
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