From: joedees@bellsouth.net
Date: Sun 08 Dec 2002 - 20:39:48 GMT
> Non-dictatorial countries are governed by consensus. The new world
> government in the form of the U.N. is also reaching for consensus. If
> we fail to achieve it, we will become ungovernable and some will seek
> to impose order rather than endure chaos or anarchy. We gain
> consensus through leadership rather than by imposition. If we don't
> learn to lead we will either have to follow or impose our will on
> others. Europe seems inclined to follow. America is trying to lead
> but doesn't seem to know how to achieve a consensus. As a result we
> get accused of imposing our will on everyone else.
>
And global stabilization is, quite simply, necessary. If the rest of the
world refuses to engage in its pursuit, it is left to the US by default.
>
> Grant
> >
> >
> > > > I forsee there a great deal of
> > > > > trouble arising in your midst, if the US government won 't
> > > > > deal with that a kind of situation. Or is that one/ the reason
> > > > > why the US intervenes so happily abroad, to elude its people
> > > > > from what is really happening internal !? After all, a good
> > > > > president is often seen as one who has a strong foreign
> > > > > policy.... strange !!
> > > >
> > > The US has a responsibility and obligation, as the world's one
> > > remaining superpower, to assist in stabilizing the global
> > > situation.
> >This
> > > position is urged upon the US by the selfsame people who complain
> > > about it, and it is acknowledged by most US citizens as a
> > > necessity
> >< thrust upon it by its pre- eminent position in the world.
> >
> >Joe,
> >Out of the all the good arguments / comments and answers from you,
> >for the sake of the list, I distilled two, IMO, hard evidence why we
> >in Europe are so contrary ! The above is the first in our memetic
> >war...
> >
> >IMO, this is a complete mis- conception on your part, you make it
> >sound like it is the US is own natural virtue to stabilize the worlds
> >situation. Virtue is a value which someone has made his own, and only
> >in the virtue the value gets its meaning. From this on the US/ its
> >foreign policy ( and that is of what we are upset about, we ain 't
> >got trouble with the American people as such) sets its own demands
> >and its very own expactations on a very high level indeed. This is a
> >' belief ' ! This can in a sense come together in two things, 1-
> >there is no longer a normalizition and freedom gets in and 2- but, it
> >can also lead to an extreme case of political corectness in thought
> >and behavior. And IMO, the latter is the thing where the US swings
> >by...
> >
> >And that ain 't something real, like you said, it is an idea.
> >It is the idea ' of being American ' that plays tricks on you, ( or
> >like the chauvinistic thing plays tricks with the French, or like the
> >über- mensch - thing plays tricks with the German), you are being
> >yourself and you express this in many ways, but in the same way, you
> >get very easily upset, you are very sensible. Your feeling of self-
> >esteem is huge, that is an American trait, proposed as like in the
> >declariation of the Union. There is nothing wrong with such a feeling
> >though, as long that selfrespect don 't grow into unassailbleness. If
> >it does, like it did IMO, than you get in trouble if something like '
> >dependents ' comes along.
> >
> >The thing to mention is that not only disasters can break the picture
> >you have of yourself but far most you depend on what ' the others '
> >have to say or do ! I don 't reproach you anything, it is just an
> >ascertainty, but it just in the ways you try to express yourself, or
> >in the ways the US tries to proove to itself its own high amount of
> >self- esteem that we see things where we get upset about. That image
> >you drag along of unassailbleness creates for us a certain amount of
> >tention, by which the sensibility of the other his/ her behavior
> >increases_ and that works both ways !
> >
> >The US, in a sense makes itself ' beautiful ', its own obligation,
> >its ne- cessity to stabilize, to indulge democracy, freedom and human
> >rights upon others, makes it beautiful, it makes you shine ! But you
> >use, " beauty " as a power, as a force in the real sense of the word.
> >Not all what is ' Beautiful ", what is ' Clean ' and ' Upright ' is
> >true, it only " Blinds "_ and that is what the US does, it dazzles,
> >not us, but itself !
> >
> >IMO, the position that is urged upon the US is only done partly by
> >the people who complain about it, you are always the half a whole and
> >in this case, you have to think about the thrusted part of your so-
> >called pre- eminent position in the world. It is not that the US is
> >the last remaining superpower that automatically you have to take the
> >world upon your shoulders. Ferrari is maybe everybody's dreamcar, but
> >that doesn 't mean the brand has to drag to automobilebusiness out of
> >its misery.
> >
> >The US is biting more off that it can chew, you're taking on res-
> >ponsibilities you can 't handle, that ain 't something you easily can
> >dismiss, it is what you ARE, and you have to understand that others
> >are not willing, by choosing or otherwise, can 't cope with that kind
> >of fact, likewise you have to understand that people are willing to
> >fight what, from there perspective, is their own in their own
> >legitimate right.
> >
> >This a memetic war, and unless the US is willing to acknowledge that
> >others have opposite ideas as to their own and are willing to fight
> >to defend those, I fear for your safety. What the Muslim world fears
> >most is enlarged in what the US stands for, and that is one reason
> >they attack you, and not, not yet anyway, I do understand this,
> >us...Europe. It is not a clear case who is actually " contrary ", it
> >is a case of who is willing to set its own memes aside_ Europe is
> >not, yet hooked on the terrorism- meme, and I hope this stays that
> >way. Out of a sense of isolation, like Lawry mentioned earlier, out
> >of that sense of unassailableness you have to come up, for yourself,
> >with the ' why ' of all of this. The American, memetic model has
> >indeed problems.
> >
> >The US is not pragmatic about itself, where IMO it is for others. It
> >is willing to set things straight where freedom and democracy fails,
> >but the US is not willing to let go of philosophical arguments like "
> >truth " even those can 't proove themselves out there in reality. (
> >James)
> >
> >Many regards,
> >
> >Kenneth
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >===============================================================
> >This was distributed via the memetics list associated with the
> >Journal of Memetics - Evolutionary Models of Information Transmission
> >For information about the journal and the list (e.g. unsubscribing)
> >see: http://www.cpm.mmu.ac.uk/jom-emit
>
>
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> ===============================================================
> This was distributed via the memetics list associated with the
> Journal of Memetics - Evolutionary Models of Information Transmission
> For information about the journal and the list (e.g. unsubscribing)
> see: http://www.cpm.mmu.ac.uk/jom-emit
>
===============================================================
This was distributed via the memetics list associated with the
Journal of Memetics - Evolutionary Models of Information Transmission
For information about the journal and the list (e.g. unsubscribing)
see: http://www.cpm.mmu.ac.uk/jom-emit
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