Re: Islamic beliefs and their memetic sources

From: joedees@bellsouth.net
Date: Sun 10 Nov 2002 - 20:06:04 GMT

  • Next message: joedees@bellsouth.net: "The ISIS site"

    I recommend that those here visit the ISIS site at: http://www.secularislam.org/

    > Greetings, Grant,
    >
    > Thanks for the summary of the Hamurabi Code. It bears virtually no
    > memetic resemblance to Muslim beliefs. Islamic beliefs are generally
    > descended memetically from Christian, Jewish, and Arab Bedu beliefs.
    > Aisha, Muhammad's wife and quite influential in his intellectual and
    > spiritual life and in the recording of his sayings and practices, was
    > Christian. Jesus and Abraham are among the prophets accepted and
    > deeply honored by Muslims. Some Muslims believe that the kaaba was
    > built by Abraham and his son.
    >
    > One of the principles of Islam is 'No revenge; no harm for harm.'
    > Restitution is the preferred way of rectifying a wrong, and there is a
    > monetary equivalence associated with many crimes or types of harm that
    > people can do to each other. A criminal can offer restitution and if
    > accepted by the victim or the victim's family, the crime and its need
    > for punishment is considered satisfied. This is quite different from
    > the 'eye-for-an-eye' belief that we associate, for example, with
    > Judaic law. I'm not sure where Christianity comes out on this. Can
    > someone fill this in? What does 'turn the other cheek mean", in a
    > criminal context? Perhaps Jeremy can outline this?
    >
    > As with many popular religions, practice varies from place to place,
    > and often for the worse. For instance, tribal Bedu law persists in
    > some parts of Arabia, and shows itself most dramatically in things
    > like amputation of a thief's hand. But I would liken this to the KKK
    > lynchings and cross burnings that permeated the US South not too long
    > ago. Dramatic, but exceptional. I have had the fortune to live in
    > several cultures, and have found that Muslim culture generally
    > produces a society in which integrity, modesty, kindness, hospitality,
    > and spirituality are prized. I have also found this true of some
    > branches of Judaic culture, and in a few Christian cultures, e.g.
    > Amish and Mennonite.
    >
    > Can you draw any parallels with the Asian cultures you are familiar
    > with?
    >
    > There are several sources I can recommend for those interested in
    > finding out more about Islam:
    >
    > 1. Visit a local mosque (Muslim, not Black Muslim) and introduce
    > yourself to the local imam. 2. Karen Armstrong's ISLAM 3. Isma'il
    > al-Faruqi's THE CULTURAL ATLAS OF ISLAM 4. John Esposito's OXFORD
    > HISTORY OF ISLAM
    >
    > and, on fundamentalism, whether, Jewish, Christian or Muslim, Karen
    > Armstrong's superb THE BATTLE FOR GOD
    >
    > On Dec. 18, 2002, PBS will broadcast a program on Muhammad and Islam.
    > I have seen some preview material on it, and I think it will be VERY
    > good.
    >
    > I can recommend many more sources to anyone interested.
    >
    > Islam has been so maliciously portrayed in the US that it is a miracle
    > Americans can understand anything at all about it, or have any
    > curiosity left with which to pursue the matter.
    >
    > Best regards,
    > Lawry
    >
    >
    > -----Original Message-----
    > From: fmb-majordomo@mmu.ac.uk [mailto:fmb-majordomo@mmu.ac.uk]On
    > Behalf Of Grant Callaghan Sent: Sunday, November 10, 2002 1:04 PM To:
    > memetics@mmu.ac.uk Subject: RE: Post-Saddam Iraq?
    >
    > >
    > >It is so much easier to make enemies than friends, in life as in
    > >international relations. The real measure of a government's
    > >proficiency is that ability to make friends.
    > >
    > >Cheers,
    > >Lawry
    > >
    > While pursuing my interest in the sources of memes I ran across this
    > article about Hamurabi's code. If you remember I broke the line of
    > conflicting memes into the Persian line and the Greco-Roman line.
    > Tell me if this sounds familiar in the memes of the Muslim thought of
    > today.
    >
    > 1700 BC: Hammurabi's Code
    >
    > This Babylonian king came to power in 1750 BC. Under his rule, a code
    > of laws was developed and carved on a huge rock column. The expression
    > "an eye for an eye" has come to symbolize the principle behind
    > Hammurabi's code. It contains 282 clauses regulating a vast array of
    > obligations, professions and rights including commerce, slavery,
    > marriage, theft and debts. The punishments are, by modern standards,
    > barbaric. The punishment for theft was the cutting off of a finger or
    > a hand. A man's lower lip was cut off if he kissed a married woman.
    > Defamation was punished by cutting out the tongue. If a house
    > collapses because the builder did not make it strong enough, killing
    > the owner, the builder was put to death. If the owner's son died, then
    > the builder's son was executed.
    >
    > Grant
    >
    > P.S. I was wrong to peg the memes at a mere 2,000 years old. It goes
    > back a lot farther than that. The Muslim memes seem to go back 4,000
    > years or more.
    >
    >
    >
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    >
    > ===============================================================
    > This was distributed via the memetics list associated with the
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    >
    >
    > ===============================================================
    > This was distributed via the memetics list associated with the
    > Journal of Memetics - Evolutionary Models of Information Transmission
    > For information about the journal and the list (e.g. unsubscribing)
    > see: http://www.cpm.mmu.ac.uk/jom-emit
    >

    =============================================================== This was distributed via the memetics list associated with the Journal of Memetics - Evolutionary Models of Information Transmission For information about the journal and the list (e.g. unsubscribing) see: http://www.cpm.mmu.ac.uk/jom-emit



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