Received: by alpheratz.cpm.aca.mmu.ac.uk id WAA07922 (8.6.9/5.3[ref pg@gmsl.co.uk] for cpm.aca.mmu.ac.uk from fmb-majordomo@mmu.ac.uk); Mon, 18 Feb 2002 22:42:08 GMT X-Originating-IP: [62.31.25.208] User-Agent: Microsoft-Outlook-Express-Macintosh-Edition/5.02.2022 Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2002 22:34:29 +0000 Subject: Re: Re: From: Steve Drew <srdrew_1@hotmail.com> To: <memetics@mmu.ac.uk> Message-ID: <B8972583.150%srdrew_1@hotmail.com> Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-OriginalArrivalTime: 18 Feb 2002 22:36:29.0511 (UTC) FILETIME=[B5264D70:01C1B8CC] Sender: fmb-majordomo@mmu.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: memetics@mmu.ac.uk
>Date: Sat, 16 Feb 2002 11:15:35 -0500
From: "Wade T.Smith" <wade_smith@harvard.edu>
Subject: Re: Re:
On Saturday, February 16, 2002, at 05:50 , Steve Drew wrote:
> As you may be aware i am not too keen on behaviour only, as i feel it
> reduces us to automata. Nothing wrong with a dose of skepticism though.
Actually, I really see no mechanism that reduces us to automata from the
memes-are-behavior-only stance.
After all, all I am saying is that _memes_ are behavior, not that all of
our behaviors are automatic or reducible.
And memes are behaviors that have a large and complex process (the
meme-factory) churning them out, and that factory is complex and
indeterminate- it is the brain/mind.
And it is a stance, a perspective, not a declaration.
- - Wade
Hi Wade,
Can't think why you thought that i thought you were adopting a declaration
instead of a position, as that would not be very skeptical. :-)
Memes as behaviour can be reduced to automatic responses as Susan Blackmore
tried to do. This is in part why i don't like this point of view and tend to
side with the ideas-objects-behaviours point.
eg. going back to our rock bashing days, one of our ancestors must have come
up with the idea of using a rock as a tool. There must have been a point
where there was some equivalent of *what if?*. Ok people copy this behaviour
and the meme bandwagon gets rolling. With language you get a second channel
of communication, as Blackmore puts it *copy the instruction*. hence you
have the idea of a behaviour, not an observation of a behaviour. So i equate
the idea of a behaviour as valid as that of the behaviour itself, the the
fidelity may not be as good.
Regards
Steve
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