Re: What are memes made of?

From: William van den Heuvel (heuvel@muc.de)
Date: Thu Feb 03 2000 - 11:37:54 GMT

  • Next message: Robin Faichney: "Re: What are memes made of?"

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    Date: Thu, 3 Feb 2000 12:37:54 +0100
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    From: William van den Heuvel <heuvel@muc.de>
    Subject: Re: What are memes made of?
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    Robin Faichney, 2000-01-30:
    >I'd be grateful for any feedback on the following essay...
    >

    In response to your request for feedback, I would like to offer you
    my view on information:

    Your article seems to be based on the notion that "information is
    simply the form, or structure, of matter". In my opinion, this notion
    of information is in some sense inadequate. I am not saying it is
    incorrect but the point I wish to make is that this is only a
    relatively insignificant aspect. A much more significant aspect is
    what the form means.

    I am inclined to think that the information is not so much in the
    form of the matter but much more in the meaning of the form.
    Furthermore, this meaning is not encoded in the form itself but is
    supplied by the observer of the form. An observer could be anything
    from elementary particle to human being. I am just calling it
    'observer' provisionally until someone proposes a better word. I
    suppose 'interpreter' would also be alright. I guess you would call
    it "decoding mechanism" but I think this is a somewhat misleading
    term as it suggests that the meaning is encoded in the form, which is
    what I question.

    Whether or not a form constitutes information is determined during
    the act of perception. Hence, without an observer or interpreter of
    some kind the form can not be information. In other words, if there
    is no perception of the form then there is no information either; it
    would just be a meaningless shape. In other words, a form can not be
    considered information without an interpreter who determines what it
    means: it's the interpreter who turns a form into information. That's
    why I regard it as somewhat inadequate to say that "information is
    simply a form or structure of matter". This way of putting it gives
    an ontological status to information that it doesn't deserve (in my
    view).

    I have tried to develop the idea of information a bit further by
    making a distinction between information in the sense of "data", and
    information in the sense of "meaning". As "data" the information has
    physical characteristics, it can be copied, encoded, transmitted,
    decoded, etc. But as "meaning" the information is implied by the
    observer. Thus, I am proposing a notion of information that has a
    dual aspect; data and meaning.

    We could even consider the possibility of information that has no
    physical form whatsoever. For instance, an interpreter can derive
    meaning from the absence of a form. I.e. a missing form or a missing
    signal can be perceived as meaningful. Therefore, absence (of form
    and matter) may very well constitute information (in the sense of
    meaning). This shows that information is not simply a form of matter
    and not even a matter of form. At best we can say, information as
    "form of matter" is only a special case. The primary aspect of
    information is the meaning, which does not necessarily require a
    particular form of matter.

    This point can be emphasized by noting that different forms with
    different physical characteristics can still have the same meaning,
    i.e. they apparently carry the same informational content. I say
    "apparently" because the form (or the missing form) doesn't actually
    inform; it only initiates a process of unfoldment on the side of the
    interpreter (resulting in a meaning). If different forms trigger the
    same process of unfoldment (resulting in the same meaning) then they
    can be said to be the same information regardless of their different
    forms or physical characteristics. Similarly, if one and the same
    physical form triggers different processes of unfoldment (resulting
    in different meanings) then it can be said to be different
    information regardless of the identical form. The essence of
    information is whether it makes a difference. There may be different
    physical forms but whether those differences make a difference in
    meaning is determined by the observer. That why I think that
    information as meaning is more significant than information as form,
    or information as matter.

    If you like to think in terms of "stances" then you could say
    information as matter is the "physical stance", and information as
    data is the "formal stance". But now I am tempted to suggest the
    introduction of an additional stance; information as meaning, which
    would be the "meaning stance". I think, each of these three stances
    are correct but which of them is more relevant or useful probably
    depends on the momentary intentions of the user.

    I don't know if this view on information is of interest to you but
    I'll just submit it for your consideration. If you see no value in it
    then please disregard it.

    William van den Heuvel
    heuvel@muc.de

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