Received: by alpheratz.cpm.aca.mmu.ac.uk id IAA02145 (8.6.9/5.3[ref pg@gmsl.co.uk] for cpm.aca.mmu.ac.uk from fmb-majordomo@mmu.ac.uk); Wed, 30 Jan 2002 08:58:17 GMT Date: Tue, 29 Jan 2002 16:46:37 +0000 To: memetics@mmu.ac.uk Subject: Re: Abstractism Message-ID: <20020129164637.A769@ii01.org> References: <AA-1A04C7B4EE944C7668FBC1D84F18EF95-ZZ@maillink1.prodigy.net> <00af01c1a479$ac039ac0$aa86b2d1@teddace> <20020124093219.B682@ii01.org> <008d01c1a5d5$db0d8d00$2cc2b3d1@teddace> <20020128101717.A523@ii01.org> <00bf01c1a889$c8d0d640$bd86b2d1@teddace> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <00bf01c1a889$c8d0d640$bd86b2d1@teddace> User-Agent: Mutt/1.3.23i From: Robin Faichney <robin@ii01.org> Sender: fmb-majordomo@mmu.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: memetics@mmu.ac.uk
On Mon, Jan 28, 2002 at 09:57:06PM -0800, Dace wrote:
>
> I'll agree that some things have greater potential than others, particularly
> as we approach the time when an event will likely occur. But until it
> occurs it's not objective. Making predictions, by itself, isn't science.
> Science is when they come true (and they didn't have to).
Science is predicated on the proposition that some things are possible
and others are not, and consists of determining which is which.
> > > But let's say all the potential information in an object has been
> > > extracted through experiments. You're still faced with the problem that
> > > the physical characteristics of the object become information only in
> > > the mind of the experimenter. Take away the experimenter, and the
> > > information is nothing more than the physical characteristics
> themselves.
> >
> > That's what physical information is.
>
> This is tautological. You're defining information as physical and then
> finding it everywhere you look in the physical world.
That's exactly right. This is true by definition, not by discovery.
My contention is not that physical information "really exists", but that
it is an extremely useful concept.
> Information is
> mental. It exists to the extent that we generate it through our
> interpretations of the world. It's a product of mental representation, and
> all animals produce it, though only humans understand it as such.
You really should join the philosophy of information list. You're so
sure you know exactly what info is, you'd liven the list up no end.
-- Robin Faichney "One person's mess is another's complexity" inside information -- http://www.ii01.org/=============================================================== This was distributed via the memetics list associated with the Journal of Memetics - Evolutionary Models of Information Transmission For information about the journal and the list (e.g. unsubscribing) see: http://www.cpm.mmu.ac.uk/jom-emit
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