Received: by alpheratz.cpm.aca.mmu.ac.uk id BAA14587 (8.6.9/5.3[ref pg@gmsl.co.uk] for cpm.aca.mmu.ac.uk from fmb-majordomo@mmu.ac.uk); Tue, 22 Jan 2002 01:24:06 GMT X-Sender: unicorn@pop.greenepa.net Message-Id: <p04320404b8726858eee1@[192.168.2.3]> In-Reply-To: <4.2.0.58.20020120182204.01d25340@mail.iinet.net.au> References: <4.2.0.58.20020120182204.01d25340@mail.iinet.net.au> Date: Mon, 21 Jan 2002 20:20:15 -0500 To: memetics@mmu.ac.uk From: "Francesca S. Alcorn" <unicorn@greenepa.net> Subject: Re: Rogue Males by Lionel Tiger Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" Sender: fmb-majordomo@mmu.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: memetics@mmu.ac.uk
Stephen said:
> The following website clarifies some of the myths, and touches on
>the ways in which Taliban women also have their important part to
>play in the oppression of Afghani men and women:
>http://members.iinet.net.au/~tramont/applied.html
>
I couldn't disagree with the general conclusions reached in this
paper. We have our own women who participate in "oppressing" women
here in the US; look at Phyllis Schlaffly. I thought the point about
women compromising themselves in order to be "cared for" was
particularly valuable too. But I disagreed with some of his other
conclusions.
First of all the distinctions which he assigned to the gender roles
didn't quite work for me. My own impression is that *conservatives*
tend to be the ones who sustain the known and police behavior, while
liberals are more involved with new ideas. If one looks here in the
US at least, conservative thought is more often associated with older
white males (at least that seems to be the conventional stereotype -
in spite Bush's attempts to portray a kinder gentler conservative
party.)
Second of all, as I understand it, women in most Muslim and Hindu
countries have *little to no* choice in whom they marry. Once they
are married the best they can hope for is a decent husband, barring
that, to make the best of a bad situation. And in many cultures
there is no alternative to being cared for, since women are not
allowed to operate house holds by themselves, run businesses etc.
There is still a great power disparity there.
Also as a mother, my responsibility towards my children has a *huge*
impact on my behavior. I don't take the chances I used to - for my
children - not for myself. Research has shown over and over again
that losing your mother before the age of five is probably the most
traumatic and crippling blow that can befall anyone. In protecting
their women - and thus their children - a culture is only ensuring
their own propagation. As men become more and more involved in
childcare this distinction becomes less clear though.
I liked his point however that our prejudice against the burka is
nothing but feminist cultural imperialism. What if an African
country where women ran around bare-breasted gained world hegemony
and accused Western countries of oppressing women because they are
required to wear shirts. How many American women would doff their
duds in the name of freedom? It is silly to equate civil rights with
a piece of cloth.
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