Received: by alpheratz.cpm.aca.mmu.ac.uk id QAA09703 (8.6.9/5.3[ref pg@gmsl.co.uk] for cpm.aca.mmu.ac.uk from fmb-majordomo@mmu.ac.uk); Sun, 20 Jan 2002 16:39:27 GMT X-Originating-IP: [199.183.183.165] From: "Grant Callaghan" <grantc4@hotmail.com> To: memetics@mmu.ac.uk Subject: Re: CRASH CONTAGION Date: Sun, 20 Jan 2002 08:35:06 -0800 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: <LAW2-F116QpFjipBLGY00007c85@hotmail.com> X-OriginalArrivalTime: 20 Jan 2002 16:35:07.0027 (UTC) FILETIME=[6B670E30:01C1A1D0] Sender: fmb-majordomo@mmu.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: memetics@mmu.ac.uk
>
>Kenneth wrote,
> > Is the US media to blame for the fact that the man mudered his 5
>children
>!?
> > This is a holistic view, a butterfly in the Amazone area can produce a
>storm
> > in Denmark....
> > IMO, the media only works as a catalyst.
> > Not showing, giving no comments equals a loss in income and viewer-
> > rates. It is hard competitive world ! -
> > _____________________________________________________
> Hi Anne,
> > IMHO the media does not work as a catalyst, (my known definition of a
> > catalyst is something that *causes* a event to happen) it may contribute
>but
> > does not cause the event!
>
><< That is the way I see the role for the media ! But to what extend the
>media does contribute is yet to be seen. The Holland- example show that
>the influence of the media is greater than we all believe, but the ' how '
>of
>that influence is yet unknown. IMO, I think that for each of us there is a
>seperate set of pathways out there that will trigger us into committing
>suicide, but to which extend that sensibility is THE trigger that you or I
>will commit suicide is open to debate.
>
> > The person ending their life, is at the end of the day, responsible for
> > her/his actions,,
>
><< Yes and no ! If you were to be a 14 years old schoolgirl raised in an
>extreme catholic environment where praying, sin and belief are the corner-
>stones of your existence, and where boys, sex and playing truant were
>your parents worst nightmare, at the end of the day your responsibility can
>be lifted if you were to ran under a train, after an uncle have been seeing
>you talking to a boy during class- hours !!
>
>(This is an event that really happened.)
>The girl ran under a train after an uncle spotted her outside the school
>talking to a unknown boy. In pure and simple panic she ran away.
>Knowing her life was over, she tried to commit suicide. ' Unfortunaly ',
>she failed... ( she is now living, far away from her family, ( who
>abandoned
>her) _ seeing boys, playing truant, trying to kill yourself,... even in the
>best families that is asking too mush ).
>
> > The media has real bad integrity but as for suicide, society in
>general
> > has a lot to answer for.. I bet out of 95% of suicides most family and
> > friends did not see much idication of the event about to happen and yet
>if
> > they did a simple conversation might have prevented the tragic event!
>
><< I agree with the fact that society has a lot to answer for ( see above),
>but friends and family don 't see at all what is bound to happen, though !
>Anne, a simple conversation can help in cases where the notion about
>committing suicide is in a very basic phase, what lies beyond such facts
>is in most cases undetectable.
>
>Suicide, they say is related to depression, but in cases wherein children
>are concerned, committing suicide is no option.
>A view on this is the following ( accordingly C. Marneffe, director of
>the Les Clairs Vallons- institute), depression is positive in therapy. It
>means
>that those children are in contact with their inner- self. Children fight
>depression by acting difficult. Teaching them ( and their parents) to cope
>with this helps.
>_ In a way, taking the ' child ' out of the kid is no way to teach your
>child(ren) responsibility. Giving them everything without any reason
>for it, is no way giving sense to the childs life...
>
>
>Regards,
>
>Kenneth
>
>
Has anybody tried to compare the number of people who saw this event in the
media and the number of people who supposedly copied it? And how many
people out there were already contemplating killing themselves or their
families? A certain number of these events happen every year, regardless.
If the rate increases significantly beyond normal, there might be a case for
transferrence. Otherwise, all I can see is coincidence.
Grant
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