Received: by alpheratz.cpm.aca.mmu.ac.uk id SAA06236 (8.6.9/5.3[ref pg@gmsl.co.uk] for cpm.aca.mmu.ac.uk from fmb-majordomo@mmu.ac.uk); Tue, 7 Aug 2001 18:17:41 +0100 Message-ID: <001501c11f64$9e575a00$f188b2d1@teddace> From: "Dace" <edace@earthlink.net> To: <memetics@mmu.ac.uk> References: <2D1C159B783DD211808A006008062D3101745FCC@inchna.stir.ac.uk><000d01c1171c$6783d260$ddd9b3d1@teddace><002101c11a02$2099ed60$9303bed4@default><002f01c11c88$087fae80$3524f4d8@teddace><000901c11dc1$430550c0$f805bed4@default> <000d01c11e9b$238ea680$0988b2d1@teddace> <001901c11eb5$834f2300$c905bed4@default> Subject: Re: Logic Date: Tue, 7 Aug 2001 10:15:32 -0700 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 Sender: fmb-majordomo@mmu.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: memetics@mmu.ac.uk
Kenneth,
> > Mechanistic theory divides memory into two kinds. The body's memory is
> > stored in genes, while the mind's memory is stored in the brain. In
> > Sheldrake's model, memory is singular. Every organ, including the
brain,
> > remembers via resonance with similar organs from the past. The "mind"
is
> > thus the memory that keeps each organ functioning the way it always has
> > before. Since the brain is attached to sense organs, the mind
associated
> > with the brain involves awareness alongside memory. Otherwise the mind
of
> > the brain is no different from the mind of the heart or the lungs or the
> > pinky toes.
>
> << Ok, I see his and your point, and in a way you say here the same
> thing like I above, but you see, written down like that, you ain 't gonna
> get evolution. Every organ remerbers its own previous state(s), where as I
> try to include ' new ' information into the genes/ organs in a way that by
> birth of a new organism that information is already part of that organism.
Evolution is not impelled by memory of past forms. It's a product of
creative adaptation on the part of organisms to changing environmental
conditions. When enough members of a species have made a particular
adaption, it then becomes part of the collective memory of that species.
> > Waddington's model can certainly be applied to memes. The question is
> > whether the epimemetic landscape is a function of genes or resonance.
Are
> > memes reducible to genes? Or are they the resonance of neural
structures
> > with previous, similar neural structures?
>
> << You see, you too stick to the view that genes control everything,
> epimemetic landscapes must be a function of the genes. Why !?
> Why can 't it be that epimemetic landscapes control in what way, to which
> extend genes unfold themselves !?
I'm arguing that memes have no relation whatsoever to genes. Memes are
associated with thought. When enough people subscribe to a particular
belief, such as the notion that evolution is a product of changing
environmental conditions and random genetic mutation, then this belief
becomes part of our collective memory.
Ted
===============================================================
This was distributed via the memetics list associated with the
Journal of Memetics - Evolutionary Models of Information Transmission
For information about the journal and the list (e.g. unsubscribing)
see: http://www.cpm.mmu.ac.uk/jom-emit
This archive was generated by hypermail 2b29 : Tue Aug 07 2001 - 18:21:54 BST