Received: by alpheratz.cpm.aca.mmu.ac.uk id QAA02604 (8.6.9/5.3[ref pg@gmsl.co.uk] for cpm.aca.mmu.ac.uk from fmb-majordomo@mmu.ac.uk); Fri, 20 Jul 2001 16:20:37 +0100 Message-ID: <2D1C159B783DD211808A006008062D3101745FBA@inchna.stir.ac.uk> From: Vincent Campbell <v.p.campbell@stir.ac.uk> To: "'memetics@mmu.ac.uk'" <memetics@mmu.ac.uk> Subject: RE: Memetic vulnerability: was: Faking It Date: Fri, 20 Jul 2001 15:48:11 +0100 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) Content-Type: text/plain X-Filter-Info: UoS MailScan 0.1 [D 1] Sender: fmb-majordomo@mmu.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: memetics@mmu.ac.uk
>> Then of course there's kin selection, so you'll tolerate and do
things for
>> relatives, reciprocal alturism where you'll do something for your
neighbour
>> if there's a good chance of something in return for you,
otherwise, everyone
>> else is competition to, very generally speaking, be aggressive
towards.
<Interesting though - this kin thing can demonstrate how far removed
we
> are from our genetics. I know quite a few people (especially amongst us
> GenXers) who find themselves as (or even more) protective of friends as
> family. Biological kin selection is all based on the number of genes you
> are likely to have in common (high between sibs); this applies in
> memetics - you will (memetically) have lots in common with family (and
> the other love-based irrational stuff) but you may have more memes in
> common with friends - who will benefit from the exact same kin selective
favouritism - kin of the mind (yeuch).>
Interesintg point. I forget the author's name, but I think the book was
called something like 'The Nuture Assumption' where the argument was that
children's behavioural/attitudinal characteristics are more heavily
influenced by their peers than their parents, that would seem to support
such a view. Perhaps kin selection in nature, should be replaced by peer
selection in culture? Certainly we know that cultural transmission is not
only vertical, but an be horizontal, and oblique (the term Dugatkin uses) in
the sense that people entirely unrelated to us in any way may transmit
behaviours to us. There does seem some evidence in youth culture that
oblique transmission at least appears to be more powerful than vertical
transmission from parents (the kind of transmission that dominates people
like Cavalli-Sforza's notions of cultural evolution).
Kin selection in nature doesn't require awareness on the part of the
organism of the relationship (does it?), but what about peer selection in
culture? Is this why youth subcultures invariably develop very distinct
modes of dress, musical tastes, patterns of speech etc., so identification
of people in the same peer group is easy?
Going back to Kenneth's idea, surely this too suggests that memes must have
at least periods of fixity so that people can recognise their own, and
opposing subcultural groups. That's not to say they can't be fluid, as with
the original punk/NF skinhead haircut being appropriated, first by the gay
community in the UK, and currently it's become a mainstream look as well.
Vincent
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