Received: by alpheratz.cpm.aca.mmu.ac.uk id OAA00980 (8.6.9/5.3[ref pg@gmsl.co.uk] for cpm.aca.mmu.ac.uk from fmb-majordomo@mmu.ac.uk); Wed, 25 Apr 2001 14:35:18 +0100 Message-ID: <2D1C159B783DD211808A006008062D3101745DF2@inchna.stir.ac.uk> From: Vincent Campbell <v.p.campbell@stir.ac.uk> To: "'memetics@mmu.ac.uk'" <memetics@mmu.ac.uk> Subject: RE: Is Suicide Contagious? A Case Study in Applied Memetics Date: Wed, 25 Apr 2001 14:31:24 +0100 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Sender: fmb-majordomo@mmu.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: memetics@mmu.ac.uk
Well, I can't answer all these questions in any detail. Certainly there are
those who question the basic assumptions of things like NLP (essentially
relating to questions of persuasion, psychology, and communication, and
probably other thigns too); another aspect in criticism is contesting the
motives and practices of NLP practioners (basically regarding them as
charlatans); the clinical establishment is generally cynical of such things;
and as for people who've had positive experiences, well we should always
treat such people as anecdotal cases, and insufficient evidence of a
practice's efficacy (after all hundreds of people say they've been abducted
by aliens but do we accept their stories as credible?).
I believe when I joined the this a little less than a year ago, members were
in the middle of heated exchange about NLP. I forget the details of those
exchanges.
> ----------
> From: Trupeljak Ozren
> Reply To: memetics@mmu.ac.uk
> Sent: Wednesday, April 25, 2001 8:44 am
> To: memetics@mmu.ac.uk
> Subject: RE: Is Suicide Contagious? A Case Study in Applied Memetics
>
> Really? I have not known that it was so controversial...why? Is it only
> because of the outregous claims they make in their advertisements? Are
> there *any* people who had positive experience with it all? What about
> the clinical establishment?
>
> --- Vincent Campbell <v.p.campbell@stir.ac.uk> wrote:
> > Oooh!!!! Touchy subject NLP (mainly 'coz it's all pants, but saying
> > so
> > winds some people up no end).
> >
> > Vincent
> >
> > > ----------
> > > From: Trupeljak Ozren
> > > Reply To: memetics@mmu.ac.uk
> > > Sent: Sunday, April 22, 2001 8:11 pm
> > > To: memetics@mmu.ac.uk
> > > Subject: Re: Is Suicide Contagious? A Case Study in Applied
> > Memetics
> > >
> > >
> > > --- "Wade T.Smith" <wade_smith@harvard.edu> wrote:
> > > > Hi Robin Faichney -
> > > >
> > > > >Are you trying to say that you admit it happens but you don't
> > > > believe
> > > > >in it?
> > > >
> > > > No, I'm saying, as I say about gods, some people believe in 'em,
> > > > follow
> > > > 'em, pray to 'em, but never have they shown 'em to anyone else.
> > > >
> > > > You can call things whatever you want, but, proofs require proof,
> > not
> > > >
> > > > simply nomenclature.
> > > >
> > > > Hypnosis as a behavior is not contestable. It is cultural. But as
> > a
> > > > scientific method with a verified mechanism it certainly is.
> > > >
> > > > - Wade
> > >
> > > If you want a scientific take on the hypnosis , try cheking out
> > > "Neuro-linguistic programming". That is as close to the science of
> > how
> > > to hypnothise someone, anyone, as I have been able to find. And
> > they
> > > actually do quite a bit of research on lower level (brain
> > structures,
> > > etc..) functioning of their techniques.
> > > And your previous assertion that you do not believe in hypnosis
> > because
> > > you can not be hypnotised reminds me very much of the argument
> > about
> > > flatness of the earth....since one could not see the curvature
> > directly
> > > (in the past), there is no curvature.
> > >
> > >
> > > =====
> > > There are very few man - and they are exceptions - who are able to
> > think
> > > and feel beyond the present moment.
> > >
> > > Carl von Clausewitz
> > >
> > > __________________________________________________
> > > Do You Yahoo!?
> > > Yahoo! Auctions - buy the things you want at great prices
> > > http://auctions.yahoo.com/
> > >
> > > ===============================================================
> > > This was distributed via the memetics list associated with the
> > > Journal of Memetics - Evolutionary Models of Information
> > Transmission
> > > For information about the journal and the list (e.g. unsubscribing)
> > > see: http://www.cpm.mmu.ac.uk/jom-emit
> > >
> >
> > ===============================================================
> > This was distributed via the memetics list associated with the
> > Journal of Memetics - Evolutionary Models of Information Transmission
> > For information about the journal and the list (e.g. unsubscribing)
> > see: http://www.cpm.mmu.ac.uk/jom-emit
> >
>
>
> =====
> There are very few man - and they are exceptions - who are able to think
> and feel beyond the present moment.
>
> Carl von Clausewitz
>
> __________________________________________________
> Do You Yahoo!?
> Yahoo! Auctions - buy the things you want at great prices
> http://auctions.yahoo.com/
>
> ===============================================================
> This was distributed via the memetics list associated with the
> Journal of Memetics - Evolutionary Models of Information Transmission
> For information about the journal and the list (e.g. unsubscribing)
> see: http://www.cpm.mmu.ac.uk/jom-emit
>
===============================================================
This was distributed via the memetics list associated with the
Journal of Memetics - Evolutionary Models of Information Transmission
For information about the journal and the list (e.g. unsubscribing)
see: http://www.cpm.mmu.ac.uk/jom-emit
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