Received: by alpheratz.cpm.aca.mmu.ac.uk id MAA07442 (8.6.9/5.3[ref pg@gmsl.co.uk] for cpm.aca.mmu.ac.uk from fmb-majordomo@mmu.ac.uk); Tue, 17 Apr 2001 12:57:12 +0100 Date: Tue, 17 Apr 2001 10:02:59 +0100 To: memetics@mmu.ac.uk Subject: Re: Determinism Message-ID: <20010417100259.A1048@ii01.org> References: <3AD133AA.6664.BBCD42@localhost><00ca01c0c113$29cfd680$5eaefea9@rcn.com><20010409183947.A685@reborntechnology.co.uk><003001c0c120$2cb138a0$5eaefea9@rcn.com><20010410091320.A553@reborntechnology.co.uk><3AD2DB0C.10E293B9@bioinf.man.ac.uk> <20010410133332.D1720@reborntechnology.co.uk> <009101c0c5c9$69a08600$5b01bed4@default> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.3.15i In-Reply-To: <009101c0c5c9$69a08600$5b01bed4@default>; from Kenneth.Van.Oost@village.uunet.be on Sun, Apr 15, 2001 at 06:30:02PM +0200 From: Robin Faichney <robin@ii01.org> Sender: fmb-majordomo@mmu.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: memetics@mmu.ac.uk
On Sun, Apr 15, 2001 at 06:30:02PM +0200, Kenneth Van Oost wrote:
>
> > > > > Freedom is subjective, not illusory.
> > >
> > > > Agreed.
> > >
> > > Would a person given a choice, at exactly the same point in time, under
> > > exactly the same environmental conditions, with the same orientation of
> > > molecules and distribution of charges around their body (incl. nervous
> > > system), always make the same choice? [Thereby obeying simple
> > > deterministic causality].
> > The only way two scenarios can be absolutely identical is if you look
> > at one scenario twice. In which case, the same decision would be
> > made.
> > I hope you don't think that's a glib or tricksy answer. I mean it
> > absolutely seriously. If everything is the same, then everything will
> > be the same.
>
> << Don 't you think of this in the same way, but I think you miscounted
> for the timescale. Time goes on, all the time. Reading the same scenario
> would mean that you make the same choise twice, maybe in your book,
> but not in mine.
> Time between those two readings moved on, the external and the internal
> world were than already changed.
But the hypothesis was that absolutely everything was the same. Of
course that's not possible in reality, which was why I said
> > The only way two scenarios can be absolutely identical is if you look
> > at one scenario twice. In which case, the same decision would be
> > made.
-- Robin Faichney Get your Meta-Information from http://www.ii01.org (CAUTION: contains philosophy, may cause heads to spin)=============================================================== This was distributed via the memetics list associated with the Journal of Memetics - Evolutionary Models of Information Transmission For information about the journal and the list (e.g. unsubscribing) see: http://www.cpm.mmu.ac.uk/jom-emit
This archive was generated by hypermail 2b29 : Tue Apr 17 2001 - 13:03:46 BST