Received: by alpheratz.cpm.aca.mmu.ac.uk id IAA02659 (8.6.9/5.3[ref pg@gmsl.co.uk] for cpm.aca.mmu.ac.uk from fmb-majordomo@mmu.ac.uk); Thu, 5 Apr 2001 08:19:12 +0100 From: <joedees@bellsouth.net> To: memetics@mmu.ac.uk Date: Wed, 4 Apr 2001 22:00:16 -0500 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: RE: The Demise of a Meme Message-ID: <3ACB9970.2718.51F5FD@localhost> In-reply-to: <E14kN8u-0004pD-00@gaea.uk.clara.net> X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.12c) Sender: fmb-majordomo@mmu.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: memetics@mmu.ac.uk
On 3 Apr 2001, at 10:30, Douglas Brooker wrote:
>
> > Arbitrary = without reference to the state or process of affairs
> > purportedly represented. Thus, onomotopoeic words (such as 'hiss'
> > for the sound a snake makes) are not arbitrary or by mutual
> > convention, since the sound of the term resembles the sound made by
> > the referent, while the name 'snake' to refer to the no-legged
> > critter that so hisses is an arbitrary term, agreed upon by mutual
> > convention; we could just as well call snakes 'egbert's', if we all
> > agreed to..
>
> This is ok so long as you keep within the boundaries of the system -
> the English language. But do all languages follow this pattern for
> the sound a snake makes? If they don't, which is likely (just an
> opinion) why have generations of English speakers chosen to use a word
> that is onomotopoeic?
>
> I haven't looked up the etymology of snake, but the slightly hissing
> sound of 'SN' evokes an echo of an hiss. This is only to suggest that
> what appears arbitrary today may not always have been so. It's
> apparent arbitrariness may be derived from a collective forgetfulness
> of the word's origin.
>
It is indeed possible that the word 'snake' began as onomatopoeic,
that is, iconic, and mutated into a more symbolic form.
> --
>
> ===============================================================
> This was distributed via the memetics list associated with the
> Journal of Memetics - Evolutionary Models of Information Transmission
> For information about the journal and the list (e.g. unsubscribing)
> see: http://www.cpm.mmu.ac.uk/jom-emit
>
>
===============================================================
This was distributed via the memetics list associated with the
Journal of Memetics - Evolutionary Models of Information Transmission
For information about the journal and the list (e.g. unsubscribing)
see: http://www.cpm.mmu.ac.uk/jom-emit
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