Received: by alpheratz.cpm.aca.mmu.ac.uk id OAA14561 (8.6.9/5.3[ref pg@gmsl.co.uk] for cpm.aca.mmu.ac.uk from fmb-majordomo@mmu.ac.uk); Thu, 22 Mar 2001 14:18:30 GMT Date: Thu, 22 Mar 2001 13:52:51 +0000 To: memetics@mmu.ac.uk Subject: Re: The Demise of a Meme Message-ID: <20010322135251.C577@reborntechnology.co.uk> References: <2D1C159B783DD211808A006008062D3101745D01@inchna.stir.ac.uk> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.3.15i In-Reply-To: <2D1C159B783DD211808A006008062D3101745D01@inchna.stir.ac.uk>; from v.p.campbell@stir.ac.uk on Thu, Mar 22, 2001 at 12:29:10PM -0000 From: Robin Faichney <robin@reborntechnology.co.uk> Sender: fmb-majordomo@mmu.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: memetics@mmu.ac.uk
On Thu, Mar 22, 2001 at 12:29:10PM -0000, Vincent Campbell wrote:
> >
> Hmm.... I think I'm talking about processes of thinking that deal
> with actual causal processes not wished for ones e.g. going out looking for
> food rather than praying for it. I think science is an extension of
> logical, rational problem-solving (that's not to say that scientific
> theories aren't memetic though).
I'm glad you take my main point. But the other one stands too: it
is not logical to say that if science is rational, then rationality
is scientific. If you *really* valued rationality, you'd know that.
> > For me, both science and Buddhism are memeplexes that reach beyond
> > themselves. Scientific memes reflect extra-memetic reality. Buddhist
> > memes tend to liberate the mind from memetic thralldom. Roughly speaking,
> > Buddhism is to experience as science is to external reality. In Buddhism
> > Without Beliefs, Stephen Batchelor argues that science and Buddhism
> > actually share their most central feature: both are based solidly on
> > radical agnosticism, where that is *not* about the existence of any
> > God or gods, but rather a refusal to cling to or avoid absolutely any
> > and every belief and/or concept whatsoever. The application of that
> > method to beliefs about the nature of external reality is science.
> > Its application to beliefs about your personal experience is Buddhism.
> >
> > And it is a method, not a belief system, which is why Buddhism is not
> > a faith. (Or rather, why *this* Buddhism is not a faith -- YMMV.)>
> >
> Well I doubt we'll ever agree on Bhuddism.
Well it would help if you (a) took the trouble to look into it a little,
and (b) read what you're replying to.
> Isn't Bhudda an idol as
> in any other faith?
As you didn't get it the first time:
> > And it is a method, not a belief system, which is why Buddhism is not
> > a faith. (Or rather, why *this* Buddhism is not a faith -- YMMV.)
-- Robin Faichney Get your Meta-Information from http://www.ii01.org (CAUTION: contains philosophy, may cause heads to spin)=============================================================== This was distributed via the memetics list associated with the Journal of Memetics - Evolutionary Models of Information Transmission For information about the journal and the list (e.g. unsubscribing) see: http://www.cpm.mmu.ac.uk/jom-emit
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