Received: by alpheratz.cpm.aca.mmu.ac.uk id XAA21522 (8.6.9/5.3[ref pg@gmsl.co.uk] for cpm.aca.mmu.ac.uk from fmb-majordomo@mmu.ac.uk); Tue, 5 Sep 2000 23:04:09 +0100 X-Sender: rrecchia@mail.clarityconnect.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: memetics@mmu.ac.uk From: Raymond Recchia <rrecchia@mail.clarityconnect.com> Subject: RE: The Alex Studies : Cognitive and Communicative Abilities of Grey Parrots Date: Tue, 5 Sep 2000 18:01:49 -0400 Message-ID: <1243931187-11688095@smtp.clarityconnect.com> Sender: fmb-majordomo@mmu.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: memetics@mmu.ac.uk
At 11:47 AM 09/05/00 +0100, you wrote:
>Sounds like an interesting book.
>
>I recently saw a children's nature programme on which they had parrots
>performing various different exercises. The key to the demonstration was
>that each of the parrots had learnt how to do things in different ways (for
>example getting to a pot of food hanging from a long rope- one pulled the
>pot up to them by pulling the rope and holding it under a foot, another
>climbed down the rope to the pot). The fact that the parrots were capable
>of problem-solving in a variety of ways, and this of course is highly
>adaptive behaviour, is a good sign of intelligence.
>
>What would be interesting, from a memetics point of view, would be if
>parrots were capable of imitating each other's strategies. Perhaps that
>book you're talking about may cover that topic. From the TV show I saw, the
>parrots performed their different strategies in plain sight of each other
>without changing their strategies- although interestingly they did appear to
>be different species of parrot (one was the blue backed yellow chest kind,
>the other was the mainly red kind- as you can tell I'm an expert on parrot
>species :-)!).
I think even Blackmore's book (or maybe it was just this discussion list)
discusses how certain elements of bird song are cultural. Birds raised in
isolation will learn a song but if raised around other birds will mimic
their songs instead. There are regional differences in bird songs that
appear to be memetic in nature. Bird song is a very limited sphere of
memetic transfer and it would be valuable to learn if animals have other
memetic behaviors. Pepperberg's work and your example from TV suggest that
this may be the case
The example you are describing from the TV show reminds me of the way
Pepperberg taught her bird. She used a Rival/Model method where a question
would be asked from human to another who would receive a reward for a
correct answer. The parrot would witness the correct response and imitate it
to get the same reward. Pepperberg used this method because the parrot
learned better this way as opposed to a straight teacher/student system.
This certainly suggests that parrots learn by imitation in the wild.
I am very interested in the abstract characterization the parrot seems
capable of. Certain people on this list have argued that a certain level of
abstraction is necessary for language and that only humans and a few related
primates are capable of this. I also have found myself been somewhat
enamored of a theory that suggests that language is necessary for abstract
thinking. Pepperberg's work suggests that abstraction is a very fundamental
process that can be learned by all sorts of animals.
>
>I read in New Scientist a while ago that the researcher you're talking about
>was considering the notion of giving the parrot access to a kind of
>'internet' to elleviate the boredom of the lab!
Yes. I had never heard of her before but I guess she is quite well known and
has even had national TV coverage.
>
>Vincent
>
>> ----------
>> From: Raymond Recchia
>> Reply To: memetics@mmu.ac.uk
>> Sent: Tuesday, September 5, 2000 3:23 am
>> To: memetics@mmu.ac.uk
>> Subject: The Alex Studies : Cognitive and Communicative Abilities of
>> Grey Parrots
>>
>> Finally got around to picking up "The Alex Studies : Cognitive and
>> Communicative Abilities of Grey Parrots"
>> by Irene Maxine Pepperberg (Harvard University Press 2000). This book
>> summarizes 20 years of Doctor Pepperberg's research into the cognition and
>> linguistic capacity of a grey parrot. I've only gotten about 80 pages
>> into
>> it so far but I am very impressed with the care with which Doctor
>> Pepperberg
>> conducted her research and with the interesting results she was able to
>> achieve.
>>
>> Dr Pepperberg was able to teach her parrot about 100 words. At the point
>> that I am at in the book the parrot has proven capable of labeling
>> individual objects, describing them in terms of their color and quantity,
>> and recognizing color and quantity as separate categories themselves.
>>
>> Amazon's review is at
>>
>> http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/067400051X/qid%3D968119632/102-5756
>> 51
>> 5-6174542
>>
>>
>> Raymond O. Recchia
>>
>>
>> ===============================================================
>> This was distributed via the memetics list associated with the
>> Journal of Memetics - Evolutionary Models of Information Transmission
>> For information about the journal and the list (e.g. unsubscribing)
>> see: http://www.cpm.mmu.ac.uk/jom-emit
>>
>
>===============================================================
>This was distributed via the memetics list associated with the
>Journal of Memetics - Evolutionary Models of Information Transmission
>For information about the journal and the list (e.g. unsubscribing)
>see: http://www.cpm.mmu.ac.uk/jom-emit
>
>
Raymond O. Recchia
===============================================================
This was distributed via the memetics list associated with the
Journal of Memetics - Evolutionary Models of Information Transmission
For information about the journal and the list (e.g. unsubscribing)
see: http://www.cpm.mmu.ac.uk/jom-emit
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