From: joedees@bellsouth.net
Date: Mon 26 May 2003 - 19:17:51 GMT
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: <joedees@bellsouth.net>
> > As I said before, to Wade, it is logically inconsistent to maintain
> > that
> the
> > mind contains and stores thoughts, ideas and memories, but deny that
> > it contains and stores the subset of them that are communicable.
>
> He Joe, that may proove not no bizarre and nonsensical after all !
> Hear me out !
>
> If we follow Wade and say, in his mind there can be no memes within
> the mind and you say that the mind contains and stores thoughts, ideas
> and memories and Wade says that those aren 't memes and you say they
> are and moreover they are the subset of those memes that are commu-
> nicable than I say, you 're both right.
>
> First, Wade insist of being the mind part of the venue, that is
> something you don 't deny either. IMO, what Wade is proposing is the
> fact that within the mind, the organ, interconnections and neurons etc
> are at work and thus operate as the cognitive functioning of the mind,
> this are no ' memes ' to Wade. Lets consider them being ' markers ' or
> ' grundnorms ' for the moment.
>
> What you say, that ideas, thoughts etc are maintained in the mind can
> be just as true, being those markers, being those grundnorms..things
> where with the mind " cognitivicly functions ". Are you with me so far
> !?
>
> If you do, good, Wade denies that the mind contains and stores the
> subset, being those memes that are communicable. If I understand his
> gut, he is saying that each time a marker, a grundnorm is activated, "
> performances " are induced, thoughts, ideas are being loosened and let
> into the open of the mind. Those are the ones that are
> communicable...the mind is than cognitivicly functioning along the
> borders of its inbedded markers, grundnorms.
>
> Those ' communicalities " are indeed than not stored, they are made
> right there within the moment of context itself. What has been bad or
> right or fault or stark will be added as being part of the marker of
> being part of the grundnorm and remerbered as the next situation comes
> along, the same but quite different.
>
> What is communicable is the informative abstract, what you think, do,
> say, hear or whatever at the very moment one says something to you.
> Your specific marker for the situation is activated, opened up, the
> mind is trying to find a respons to the stimili, finds ones and fires
> the neurons, what is maintained is the marker, what will/ can/ could,
> maybe will be contained is the information you re- ceived by the fact
> someone said something to you and you respon- ded to his hails. If it
> does it is added alongside its marker, if not it will be forgotten.
>
> What is made up at the very moment of context itself can 't be
> part of the stored thoughts, ideas and memories you talk about.
> What the consequence of one's actions will be upon yourself
> can only be a fact at the very moment it will occur.
> The very fact of performing at that moment can 't be known to you, and
> therefor each possible respons can 't be hold within the mind. Thus
> IMO, yes, the mind can 't hold within the subset of the ones that were
> to be communicable, only fractions, ' maxims ', markers, grundnorms
> remain.
>
> But what is added and why is still a mistery, not the whole package
> that's for sure.
>
> Is this clear or what....!?
> Still a Mars bar away from the Milky Way I suppose....
>
> Regards though,
>
> Kenneth
>
This difference is a stark either/or; it is not possible to resolve it by a
both/and synthesis or a little-if-this/little-of-that compromise. Either
memories thoughts and ideas are encoded in the brain or they are not.
If they are encoded, then certainly the communcable subset of them
that is, memes, are also cortically encoded. Either there is a distinction
between the subjective (that only apprehendable by a single person, i.e.
sensations, perceptions and stream-of-consciousness) and the
intersubjective (that which is apprehendable by multiple people, i.e. our
shared environment - the external world) or there is not. Logic, reason
and evidence leads me to the former conclusion in both these cases.
>
> ===============================================================
> This was distributed via the memetics list associated with the
> Journal of Memetics - Evolutionary Models of Information Transmission
> For information about the journal and the list (e.g. unsubscribing)
> see: http://www.cpm.mmu.ac.uk/jom-emit
>
===============================================================
This was distributed via the memetics list associated with the
Journal of Memetics - Evolutionary Models of Information Transmission
For information about the journal and the list (e.g. unsubscribing)
see: http://www.cpm.mmu.ac.uk/jom-emit
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