From: joedees@bellsouth.net
Date: Mon 10 Mar 2003 - 01:30:56 GMT
> I am not justifying saddams actions but much of the deaths are the
> fault of the US. Iraq does not have the proper facilities to produce
> chlorine. it is also from lack of anti-biotics that so many innocent
> iraqi children are dying.
>
Antibiotic which Saddam could easily purchase with those petrobillions;
he could also tell his people to boil their water if he is unwilling to
sterilize it for them. However, the deaths are a good propaganda tool
for his regime; they detract attention from all the people he tortures and
murders. For instance, the Kurds, at 30 million (six times the
Palestinian population), the largest stateless group in the world. More
Kurds were killed in one poison gas attack one afternoon in Halabja
than Palestinians have been killed in both intifadehs. And why do the
Kurds not receive the world's attantion? Perhaps because under the
northern no-fly zone they are establishing a quasi-democratic market
economy, complete with freedom of religion and expression, civil rights,
and gender qquality (including four female judges), instead of blowing
up Israeli teenagers dancing at discos (a proctice for which Saddam
pays 25k per shaheed).
My question for you is, how could you, as a green candidate, support
the perpetuation of such a despotic fascist murderer, who massively
abuses the human rights of millions of men and women daily, and who
is quite willing to commit global ecological sabotage out of sheer bile
and spite?
>
> *Peace*
> Bryan Thompson
> Living Proof - Berkley paperback - March 2003
> Government secrets/biological weapons/human subjects
> http://www.peterjthompson.net
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: <joedees@bellsouth.net>
> To: <memetics@mmu.ac.uk>
> Sent: Sunday, March 09, 2003 6:57 PM
> Subject: Re: Memes For Peace-at-any-Price
>
>
> > > might I remind you that almost all of those deaths have been
> > > caused by US economic sanctions that do not allow iraq to purchase
> > > items such as chlorine to treat water or anti biotics. this has
> > > caused the death of more than 400,000 iraqi children alone in the
> > > past 12 years.
> > >
> > Might I remind you that chlorine can be produced from sea salt, but
> > that Saddam, who has been the recipient of billions per year in UN-
> > sanctioned oil sales, did not use them to help his people, but
> > rather plowed them into his Republican Guards, his WMD programs, and
> > the construction of 50+ palaces, each with an Olympic + sized pool
> > fed by fountains. And need I remind you that many of those deaths
> > have been attributed to his use of chemical weapons against the
> > Kruds, his destruction of the Kuwaiti oil fields, which poisoned
> > much of southern Iraq, and his destruction of the Shia's marshland
> > terrain.
> > >
> > > *Peace*
> > > Bryan Thompson
> > > Living Proof - Berkley paperback - March 2003
> > > Government secrets/biological weapons/human subjects
> > > http://www.peterjthompson.net
> > >
> > >
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: <joedees@bellsouth.net>
> > > To: <memetics@mmu.ac.uk>
> > > Sent: Sunday, March 09, 2003 2:52 PM
> > > Subject: Re: Memes For Peace-at-any-Price
> > >
> > >
> > > > > I agree that memes have been engineered by advertising and
> > > > > governments. what I am proposing is that we use memetic
> > > > > engineering for peaceful means to stop war and save lives. I
> > > > > think that this is a much more noble cause than selling
> > > > > underwear or cola.
> > > > >
> > > > Stopping this war would COST many more lives than pursuing it
> > > > would. Not pursuing it 12 years ago has already cost a the lives
> > > > of nearly a million Iraqis.
> > > > >
> > > > > *Peace*
> > > > > Bryan Thompson
> > > > > Living Proof - Berkley paperback - March 2003
> > > > > Government secrets/biological weapons/human subjects
> > > > > http://www.peterjthompson.net
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > > > From: "Jeremy Bradley" <jeremyb@nor.com.au>
> > > > > To: <memetics@mmu.ac.uk>
> > > > > Sent: Sunday, March 09, 2003 1:21 PM
> > > > > Subject: Re: Memes For Peace
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > > At 09:53 PM 9/03/03 +1100, Bruce wrote:
> > > > > > Snip......................
> > > > > > While I tend to agree with Joe on the humanitarian aspect of
> > > > > > the Iraq situation, there are other issues implicit in the
> > > > > > wording of Bryan's post which cause concern. The least not
> > > > > > being the concept of "memetic engineering", which I think is
> > > > > > an oxymoron. Even the opposing forces within the memetics
> > > > > > definition debate agree that a meme is a cultural
> > > > > unit.
> > > > > > Is not culture the conglomerate of inherited ideas,
> > > > > > beliefs, values and
> > > > > > knowledge? Have not all attempts to overtly "engineer"
> > > > > > culture failed?
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Jeremy's reply:
> > > > > > I don't think so Bruce, hasn't Hollywood been active in the
> > > > > > production of memes which reach out across the globe? Is
> > > > > > this not memetic engineering? When I was living with an
> > > > > > Indigenous Australian group which had not had a lot of
> > > > > > outside contact, the change in children's behaviour was
> > > > > > observable when they got a VCR and started watching USAnian
> > > > > > crap. For me, memetic engineering is akin to propaganda, but
> > > > > > it operates at a more subtle level. If we look at the Nazi
> > > > > > regime's manipulation of art and theatre, we can
> > > > > see
> > > > > > this effect, and, dare I say, it is observable in poor Joe's
> > > > > > foaming at
> > > > > the
> > > > > > mouth replies to any critique of his beloved USAnia's war on
> > > > > > Islam. Making war to create peace is an oxymoron and can
> > > > > > never work. War, especially such a one sided war, will
> > > > > > perpetuate violence and only profit arms dealers. Sorry to
> > > > > > be lurking for so long all. And Joe, don't worry, I am far
> > > > > > too busy to reply too much at the moment as I am running an
> > > > > > election campaign. But, to quote a great USanian memetic
> > > > > > construct, I'll be back. Jeremy the do-gooder
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Jeremy Bradley - The Greens' Candidate in Oxley
> > > > > > 3200 Oxley Hwy Wauchope 2446
> > > > > > Phone:02 65856652 or 02 65856134
> > > > > > Mobile: 0428 856134
> > > > > > E-mail: jeremyb@nor.com.au
> > > > > >
> > > > > > ============================================================
> > > > > > === This was distributed via the memetics list associated
> > > > > > with the Journal of Memetics - Evolutionary Models of
> > > > > > Information Transmission For information about the journal
> > > > > > and the list (e.g. unsubscribing) see:
> > > > > > http://www.cpm.mmu.ac.uk/jom-emit
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > ==============================================================
> > > > > = This was distributed via the memetics list associated with
> > > > > the Journal of Memetics - Evolutionary Models of Information
> > > > > Transmission For information about the journal and the list
> > > > > (e.g. unsubscribing) see: http://www.cpm.mmu.ac.uk/jom-emit
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > ===============================================================
> > > > This was distributed via the memetics list associated with the
> > > > Journal of Memetics - Evolutionary Models of Information
> > > > Transmission For information about the journal and the list
> > > > (e.g. unsubscribing) see: http://www.cpm.mmu.ac.uk/jom-emit
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > > ===============================================================
> > > This was distributed via the memetics list associated with the
> > > Journal of Memetics - Evolutionary Models of Information
> > > Transmission For information about the journal and the list (e.g.
> > > unsubscribing) see: http://www.cpm.mmu.ac.uk/jom-emit
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> > =============================================================== This
> > was distributed via the memetics list associated with the Journal of
> > Memetics - Evolutionary Models of Information Transmission For
> > information about the journal and the list (e.g. unsubscribing) see:
> > http://www.cpm.mmu.ac.uk/jom-emit
> >
> >
>
> ===============================================================
> This was distributed via the memetics list associated with the
> Journal of Memetics - Evolutionary Models of Information Transmission
> For information about the journal and the list (e.g. unsubscribing)
> see: http://www.cpm.mmu.ac.uk/jom-emit
>
===============================================================
This was distributed via the memetics list associated with the
Journal of Memetics - Evolutionary Models of Information Transmission
For information about the journal and the list (e.g. unsubscribing)
see: http://www.cpm.mmu.ac.uk/jom-emit
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