Re: I know one when I see one

From: joedees@bellsouth.net
Date: Sun 27 Oct 2002 - 20:19:36 GMT

  • Next message: Van oost Kenneth: "Re: electric meme bombs"

    > Dear Ted,
    >
    > > > > The question of memetics is the question of
    > > > > whether these elements of culture carry their own momentum,
    > > > > their own drive to reproduce.
    > > >
    > > > Bullshit.
    > >
    > > I don't appreciate this. Your comment reveals hostility. Where is
    > > this hostility coming from?
    > >
    >
    > I apologize for the vulgarity, Ted. But I have no hostility towards
    > you. :-)
    >
    > It's just that when you start personifying memes, talking about "drive
    > to reproduce," and so on, you are not only going off into la-la land,
    > you are setting up a paper tiger that is easy to demolish rather than
    > addressing what memetics is really about.
    >
    > > You badly misunderstand memetics. Without "selfishness," in the
    > > sense of "selfish gene," the whole idea is shot.
    >
    > What do you think the "selfishness" of the "selfish gene" means?
    >
    > > If memes are just ideas or
    > > catch-phrases or tunes or habitual behaviors (like wearing a
    > > baseball cap backwards), then we don't need to refer to them as
    > > memes. Unless they're self-replicating, we can just as easily refer
    > > to them with the same terms we've always used. It's their
    > > self-replication that marks them off as the cultural equivalent of
    > > genes.
    >
    > Genes do not self-replicate, either.
    >
    > All that memes require is replication, variation, and selection.
    >
    Yep; 'selfishness' is a badly chosen and anthropomorphic metaphor, not a concrete actuality.
    > Ciao,
    >
    > Bill
    >
    > ===============================================================
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    > see: http://www.cpm.mmu.ac.uk/jom-emit
    >

    =============================================================== This was distributed via the memetics list associated with the Journal of Memetics - Evolutionary Models of Information Transmission For information about the journal and the list (e.g. unsubscribing) see: http://www.cpm.mmu.ac.uk/jom-emit

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