Received: by alpheratz.cpm.aca.mmu.ac.uk id WAA24142 (8.6.9/5.3[ref pg@gmsl.co.uk] for cpm.aca.mmu.ac.uk from fmb-majordomo@mmu.ac.uk); Mon, 31 Jan 2000 22:15:42 GMT Message-ID: <B0009900080@ns2.htcomp.net> X-Sender: mmills@pop3.htcomp.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.0 Date: Mon, 31 Jan 2000 17:15:41 -0500 To: memetics@mmu.ac.uk From: "Mark M. Mills" <mmills@htcomp.net> Subject: Re: Fwd: Re: What are memes made of? In-Reply-To: <00013119035303.00393@faichney> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: fmb-majordomo@mmu.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: memetics@mmu.ac.uk
Robin,
MM>It seems that one of your main points is differentiation of substance
MM>isomorphism and formal isomorphism. Your comment that evolutionary
MM>biologists use 'hierarchical, recursive definition, so that one higher
MM>level gene is composed of two or more lower level ones" was very, very
MM>interesting. Unfortunately, this theme was not explored explicitly.
>
>It's not my idea. I can't recall for the moment where I first came across
it,
>but I'm fairly sure it was discussed in the public session of the Kings
College
>meeting in May '99 -- can anyone help me out here? Though I don't have it to
>hand, I believe Dawkins explicitly uses the recursive definition in The
>Selfish Gene.
This is something that should be explored. I don't remember anything in
the Selfish Gene suggesting a multilevel 'gene.'
You mention earlier in your reply that 'I don't think that the identity of
genes is a controversial area.' I suspect the notion of a multilevel gene
is controversial. VANWYHE@aol.com said "Robert I think your subject a
fascinating one but I think your conclusion needs more thought. "Higher
levels of organization" is rather figurative language."
Brodie said "So you believe that chain letters are encoded in human DNA?
;-)". Kenneth Van Oost said "Do you mean that not only the genes pass on
their genetic info but also the neuro- logocal representations of what is
encoded in the gene!?"
Each of these comments requests a further exploration of the 'multilevel
gene' proposition. As I write, every person responding to the essay
touches on this issue.
You have certainly found something of great interest!
>If had the "technical equipment", I'd very much like to attempt a formal
>characterisation of the relationship between physical and intentional
>information, but I doubt I could manage it alone. Perhaps with the right
sort
>of collaboration, though.........?
Let's say you had all the equipment money could buy. What would you do
with it? What equipment could test the relationship between 'physical and
intentional information'? For example, NASA's Shuttle Radar Topography
Mission will use the largest space based structure ever put in orbit for 3d
images of the earth's surface. Is this the kind of equipment you would need?
Mark
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