Re: "scientism"

Chris Lees (
Sat, 10 Apr 1999 01:27:14 +0100

Date: Sat, 10 Apr 1999 01:27:14 +0100
From: Chris Lees <>
Subject: Re: "scientism"

Jake wrote:

> This wasn't in the previous EM. Go back and read it. It simply isn't
> there. It must be convenient to make it up as you go along.

Everyone on this planet is making it up as they go along.
I assumed you'd do a web search, but, pardonnez-moi, I just
did, and it seems to have gone, so here's the gist from another

(Apologies to those on the list who are'nt interested, and
apologies for not finding the full text for those who are...
it's out there somewhere, or else get a library to get the
journal. This is old stuff, and there is more recent. )



The experiment conducted by neurophysiologist Grinberg-Zylberbaum,
however,negates this current ‘scientific wisdom’ about mental telepathy.
See The Einstein- Podolsky-Rosen Paradox in the Brain; The Transferred
Potential,Physics Essays 7,(4), 1994. From this paper we read,

"The purpose of this paper is to demonstrate the existence of a
macroscopic quantum system in the human brain through the demonstration of EPR
non-local correlation between brains".

The brain is postulated in SWC to consist of two interacting "classical"
and "quantum" systems. The classical system acts as the measurement
apparatus for the quantum system, and the classical system records the result as
awareness. An EPR type of non-local connection was believed to be
necessary over the width of the cortical tissue at the molecular level at the
neuronal synapses in order for intelligence to operate. Consciousness, acting
non-locally and self-referentially, is then taken to be the agent for
collapsing the states of the dual quantum-system/classical-measurement

According to Grinberg-Zylberbaum’s syntergic theory, the conjugated
activity of all neuronal elements of a working brain forms an interaction matrix
called the neuronal field. We posit that the neuronal field represents
the effects of the quantum measurement by the measurement apparatus of the
brain. The neuronal field is thus the manifestation upon measurement of
the state of the brain that exists in potentia before measurement. It is
this neuronal field that is indicated locally in the electro-encephalographic
(EEG) readings".

Grinberg-Zylerbaum knew from earlier work that phase coherence between
electro-EEG records was enhanced when two people meditate together. In
this experiment two subjects therefore meditated together for twenty minutes.
A total of seven pairs of subjects of both sexes, with ages from 20-44
years participated in the study. After meditation and while maintaining their
"direct communication" (without speech), they were placed in semi-silent,
electro-magnetically shielded chambers separated by 45 feet.

[Image] [Image]

Figure 1 (left) and Figure 2 show in their upper portions the averages
obtained from 100 evoked potentials. The middle portion shows the
average of 100 epochs of EEG in Subject B synchronized to the stimuli presented to
Subject A. The lower parts of the figures show both averages superimposed.
These figures show the complete set of samples registered after subject
interaction. The correlation index obtained in the first 132 ms for the
potentials of Figure 11 was meaningful with p<0.009. The same for Figure
2 for the first 73 ms was meaningful with p<0.005. Note also the
difference in scales of the ordinate between the evoked and transferred potentials

Both subjects were connected to EEG instruments and 100 random flashes
of light were presented to subject A, while both remained reclined with
semi-closed eyes. Subject B was not told when the light was flashed for
subject A, and control correlation checks were also made at random times
with no light flashes.

The results indicated that,: "after a meditative interaction between two
people who were instructed to maintain direct communication (i.e. to
feel each other’s presence even at a distance), in about one out of four
cases when one of the subjects was stimulated in such a way that his/her brain
responded clearly (with a distinct evoked potential), the brain of the
nonstimulated subject also reacted and showed a transferred potential of
a similar morphology....

The striking similarity of the transferred and evoked potentials and the
total absence of transferred potentials in the control experiments leave
no room for doubt about the existence of an unusual phenomenon, namely,
propagation of influence without local signals.... The similarity (of
potentials) reflected in the EEG must be due to the close correspondence
of the neuronal fields of the two correlated brains after collapse. In
other words, the phenomenon we are dealing with is the action of non-local
collapse of the wave function of a unified system and not the result of
a transmission using local signals from one brain to the other".

"It is also extremely significant that the occurrence of transferred
potential is always associated with the participants’ feeling that their
interaction is successfully completed (in contrast to the lack of
transferred potential, when there is no such feeling). The interaction
that correlates the subjects under study is entirely an interaction via
non-local consciousness. This indicates that consciousness is involved in the
process of correlation, and thus the idealist interpretation that consciousness
collapses the quantum wave function upon measurement is essential to
make sense of the present data. ... "none of the subjects B ever reported
realizing any type of conscious experience related to the appearance of
the transferred potential".

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