Re: ply to Grant

From: Grant Callaghan (
Date: Tue Feb 05 2002 - 22:58:32 GMT

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    From: "Grant Callaghan" <>
    Subject: Re: ply to Grant
    Date: Tue, 05 Feb 2002 14:58:32 -0800
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    >>Date: Tue, 05 Feb 2002 07:18:26 -0800
    >From: "Grant Callaghan" <>
    >Subject: Re: ply to Grant
    >It IS worth billions.  Just look at the culture that Bill Gates built
    >the billions he collected for his efforts.  The same goes for Hewlett
    >Packard, Apple and Intel.  They didn't just invent new products.  They
    >invented new ways of organizing labor and management so that labor was
    >to share the riches and become totally involved in the work they were
    >  Tom Peters propagated these ideas in his books on how these ideas
    >big business.<
    >I agree with you and disagree. Asi said earlier, it= thought Naomi Klien
    >the gist of it in that big buisness picked upon the idea of memes without
    >any notion of theory. To her it is termed *brand* - it conveys an idea of
    >the company and not its products. Hence bill Gates get his billions (He has
    >even talked openly about making his software more reliable, which will be
    >nice {ok i'm biased i use Apple, ).
    >On the minus side, yes some folks did get rich, but if Kliens book is true
    >many others got poorer. many of Tom Peters reccomendations are for
    >outsourcing. The (any) company becomes a marketing company (meme factory?),
    >with the productyion of goods, relegated to contractors, with the use of
    >casual labour, far east sweat shops etc I think Aarron referred to this
    >danger earlier, and it is a real danger.
    I get the impression we're talking about different things. I'm talking
    about the culture of manufacturing and you seem to be talking about
    marketing and products, which is a separate but associated culture. If a
    sweat shop produces a part for Microsoft, that has little or nothing to do
    with the culture Bill Gates and his associates built on their campus in
    Seattle Washington. Judgements about whether this is good or bad for
    society have no relevance that I can see. As always, it will be good for
    some people and bad for others. That's a position from the eye of the
    beholder. It wasn't long ago the Chinese thought communist economics were
    good for everybody. Now they like capitalism and the WTO. They may change
    their minds again. Who knows? Who cares, other than the Chnese? The one
    thing you can be sure of is that minds will change and so will culture.


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