Re: neccesity of mental memes

From: Joe Dees (joedees@addall.com)
Date: Fri Feb 01 2002 - 05:43:51 GMT

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    Date: Thu, 31 Jan 2002 21:43:51 -0800
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    From: "Joe Dees" <joedees@addall.com>
    To: memetics@mmu.ac.uk
    Subject: Re: neccesity of mental memes
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    > "Steve Drew" <srdrew_1@hotmail.com> memetics@mmu.ac.uk Re: neccesity of mental memesDate: Thu, 31 Jan 2002 23:28:31 +0000
    >Reply-To: memetics@mmu.ac.uk
    >
    >Date: Wed, 30 Jan 2002 07:40:28 -0800
    >From: "Grant Callaghan" <grantc4@hotmail.com>
    >Subject: Re: neccesity of mental memes
    >
    >> >
    >>Because we are using a natural, uniform and ubiquitous component of the
    >>universe as our stick, not something arbitrary or rooted in
    >>anthropomorphism.† It does not matter what you call the unit of
    >measurement
    >>(since language is itself arbitrary and by mutual convention), so long
    >as
    >>your peers understand it, and it fulfills the above requirements.† We
    >are
    >>not assigning a value to the protom-radius, we are naming it; it will
    >>remain the same length whatever we call it, and that takes the
    >>arbitrariness out of the referent, even though linguistic signs
    >themselves
    >>are, for the most part (excluding, say, onomatopoeic words),
    >irretrieveably
    >>arbirary.
    >> >
    >> >Steve
    >> >
    >
    >Now we're talking the same language.
    >
    >Grant
    >
    >I think you left my name attached to one of Joe Deeís posting Grant.
    >
    >Just because something we have decided is a fundamentak measurement of the
    >universe that is suitable as a unit of measurement of the universe doesnot
    >make it any different to a metallic rod. The metal rod will appear to an
    >observer under the same conditions the same each time. How is that different
    >from the the radius of a proton? And this radius is not absolutely defined
    >that i am aware, due to the problem of the wave / particle duality (and if
    >you include one of my old lecturers, he described it as an energy field), so
    >what measurement are we on about. The truth of the matter as i see it, is
    >that external reality exists [my assumption - it makes life easier for me :
    >- ) ] but that our interpretation of it is not always up to scratch. I donít
    >see that assigning a value to something as any different to nameing it.
    >(Some one also mentioned a 9 dimensional universe - i got the impression
    >they were working on 13, and that they did unfold but are not visible above
    >the sub atomic?)
    >
    >I would appreciate some clarification,
    >
    Because in one case our measurement referent is artificial and arbitrarily chosen and by mutual convention (kinda like non-onomatopoeic words), and in the other case the measurement referent is natural and actual; the smallest uniform length we can discover in the universe (which as the added benefit that evey length would have to be in integral multiples of the measurement referent - no fractions or remainders could exist).
    >
    >Steve
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >_________________________________________________________________
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    >
    >===============================================================
    >This was distributed via the memetics list associated with the
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    This was distributed via the memetics list associated with the
    Journal of Memetics - Evolutionary Models of Information Transmission
    For information about the journal and the list (e.g. unsubscribing)
    see: http://www.cpm.mmu.ac.uk/jom-emit



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