Received: by alpheratz.cpm.aca.mmu.ac.uk id JAA24418 (8.6.9/5.3[ref email@example.com] for cpm.aca.mmu.ac.uk from firstname.lastname@example.org); Wed, 16 Jan 2002 09:47:58 GMT To: email@example.com Message-Id: <AA-533B2C7785077BA37F29D04511292C5F-ZZ@maillink1.prodigy.net> Date: Wed, 16 Jan 2002 04:44:04 -0500 From: "Philip Jonkers" <PHILIPJONKERS@prodigy.net> Subject: Re: Paranoid Schizophrenia and Memetics Sender: firstname.lastname@example.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: email@example.com
>So okay i want to write something. My interest in
>because i was wondering why people are so interested
>works and why so much efforts and time gets spend on
>products, art, trends...
>Spending some months in this group i was discussing
>about what memes actually are and other not really
>What i still don't understand is what memes are
actually about. Are
>they developing and evoluting indepently from us. Do
they live in a
>virtual sphere where their evolution happens? Is
>based on us, do WE select them? So there are these
>opinions, some say that memes are just tools to be
Humans have developed culture. Culture consists of
memes. So humans must have developed memes. The only
organ capable of that developing role is the brain.
So brains have developed memes, no metaphysical
spheres needed. Well perhaps as an abstract depiction
it may help, but it's not physically present.
Occam's razor won't permit.
>But there are too many things i don't understand,
where's the fight
>between different cultural, religious, economic
>from. If memes are just tools for the individual to
use why all the
>fight and the flamewars in newsgroups?
Memes are valuable or represent valuable things such
as tools to hunt, make money, or engage other
profitable activity. Anything valuable is worth a
fight, it's a natural thing. Humans are no different
>For me i think memes are on a large scale mostly
>influence and as culture is the most important
>in todays human life yeah memes are used to produce
>situations where certain genes will survive.
>Maybe i'm totally fucked out crazy but doesn't it
make sense? We
>try to shape the world so that we and the people we
>survive in it. But everyone has different ideas and
beliefs about how
>such a world has to be. When someone like Jesus comes
>there's a person who unites a large number of
people's ideas and
>feelings about how bad things are and how they should
>That's where memetic evolution comes from. Maybe this
is all not
>relevant at all (cause it's fact) and discussion and
knowledge of it is
>useless, one shall rather discuss and change culture
>how and why it's done at all.
>Rather fuck than talking about the biological sense
>Rather start a revolution than talking about the
I don't mind people using that 4-letter word, but some
on this list may be offended by it. It's perhaps
better not to use that word again. Other than carrying
a emotional charge it doesn't convey anything also.
ps. That doesn't mean I don't curse & swear! I'm not
holier than the pope myself, but I don't do it on
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