Re: Knowledge, Memes and Sensory Perception

From: Ray Recchia (
Date: Tue Jan 15 2002 - 09:19:24 GMT

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    Date: Tue, 15 Jan 2002 04:19:24 -0500
    From: Ray Recchia <>
    Subject: Re: Knowledge, Memes and Sensory Perception
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    At 01:51 AM 1/15/2002 -0500, you wrote:
    >On Tuesday, January 15, 2002, at 12:30 , Joe Dees wrote:
    >>I hold the "the scientific method is a valid investigatory tool for
    >>understanding our world" meme. Even when I am completely still, it
    >>remains in my mind, and may be decoded into any number of different
    >>behaviors, depending upon the object of study, which share this common
    >>principle. The behaviors (plural) are examples of how their common
    >>motivating meme may be expressed, and it may be expressed in a plethora
    >>of related, but nevertheless differing ways.
    >You cannot show me any portion of this motivation without behaving in some
    >manner to show me. There is no 'may'.
    >Your behavior is the only meme. And I might, or might not, arrive at _any_
    >sort of memetic understanding about it, unless I attempt my own behavior.
    >Whatever expression you decide to use, what you _think_ you are doing
    >does, yes, determine, to a degree, but not totally, what your behavior is.
    >(What you meant to express is not always what you end up expressing,
    >unless your skill level is very high.)
    >I personally like the scientific method- my understanding of it is
    >pleasant to me- and I might just understand, and attempt to replicate,
    >almost all of your behavior, maybe even all of it.
    >But, I might be a person who hates the scientific method, and I will then
    >reject any attempt at replicating your behavior, and, if I am the only
    >person you show your behavior to, your meme dissipates.
    >There is no evidence of your motivation, and no expression of it, without
    >a behavior on your part. If you are lucky and skillful, an artefact is
    >expressed, and some viable culture is available to present it within,
    >where it enjoys a sustaining existence. (Not a cargo culture, for
    >instance, where there is no reference for understanding what you are
    >expressing, and therefore no possibility of replicating behavior, or
    >sustaining meaning.)
    >Whether you think you hold something in your mind that motivates you or
    >not is irrelevant to the memetic progress your idea will make. Indeed, it
    >is quite possible that I will attempt a behavior that is entirely at odds
    >with your motivation. Your behavior is all that is memetic. I will only
    >see what I will see- from my own vantage.

    Please demonstrate the behavior associated with the meme "The Earth
    revolves around the Sun." In fact that there are a variety of behaviors
    associated with it that can also be associated with a number of other
    memes. "The Earth revolves around the Sun" exists as a meme and
    undoubtedly thousands of teachers in schools around the planet today will
    be determining with a fair degree of accuracy whether or not their students
    have acquired it.

    How do you know whether someone has a meme or not? You ask them.

    Ray Recchia

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