Received: by alpheratz.cpm.aca.mmu.ac.uk id AAA05687 (8.6.9/5.3[ref email@example.com] for cpm.aca.mmu.ac.uk from firstname.lastname@example.org); Sun, 23 Dec 2001 00:50:07 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: wolfe.umd.edu: debivort owned process doing -bs Date: Sat, 22 Dec 2001 19:45:50 -0500 (EST) From: "Lawrence H. de Bivort" <email@example.com> X-Sender: firstname.lastname@example.org To: email@example.com Subject: RE: conditional support for war on Iraq In-Reply-To: <firstname.lastname@example.org> Message-ID: <Pine.OSF.email@example.com> Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: firstname.lastname@example.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: email@example.com
Uh, that was sarcasm, Jeremy. Indeed, I have given considerable thought to
what it must be like to be such a victim, and I imagine I would do just
what some of them try to do -- only I hope I would be able to do it more
I do like the term 'meme-team.' Yours?
On Tue, 18 Dec 2001, Jeremy Bradley wrote:
>As me old Grandmother used to say: "you can't be good for nothing if you
>are good for a bad example". This communication is a bad example of myopic
>What makes you believe in the 'might-is-right' meme? Do you ever think
>about what it is like as a victim of US agression? What would you do in
>At 10:57 PM 14/12/01 -0500, you wrote:
>>>From: "Lawrence DeBivort" <firstname.lastname@example.org>
>>>Subject: RE: conditional support for war on Iraq
>>>Date: Fri, 14 Dec 2001 13:52:04 -0500
>>>And after Iraq, who do you not like next?
>>After we help the Iraqi people establish a more friendly gov't you mean?
>>It's Hussein and his regime which are the problem, not the Iraqi people.
>>I have no animosity towards Pakistan, even if the ISI had any Taliban
>>connection or regardless of whether their madrassas were recruiting grounds.
>>I hope they can maintain peace with India, though the situation over Kashmir
>>is volatile. I'd like to see a democratic leadership there. Didn't Musharif
>>(sp?) oust Nawaz Sharif and impose a miltary style rule over that country.
>>Maybe Bhutto can make another run at it. I dunno.
>>Contrary to the sentiments of the exiles in South Florida, I'd like to see
>>us normalize relations with Cuba and foster a more beneficial situation to
>>be in place when Castro finally kicks the bucket (around 2075 or so).
>>Attack an ally? What have they done to us besides that ugly USS Liberty
>>situation. I'd like to see them and Palestine get along better, but things
>>don't look so good for that happening.
>>China is a country to be watched closely. The situation with that plane a
>>while back showed that even at the brink of conflict we were able to reason
>>with them and Bush came out looking not too shabby. We should treat China as
>>a nation which must earn our trust. I've got reservations about them. I'd
>>certainly not want to come to blows with them, because the repercussions
>>would be potentially catastrophic. Maybe over time the relationship will
>>grow more amicable, but I'm wondering how the human rights situation is
>>going over there.
>>>Burma? In what order do you suggest the US issue
>>>ultimatums and attack them? Ooops, I forgot a few: Haiti (double-ooops, I
>>>forgot, we already did them. I'm sure Haiti is in great shape as a result.
>>I'm not a big fan of humanitarian campaigns, though at least Haiti was
>>important because of its closeness to our shores.
>>>Does anyone know?), Uganda, Mali -- definitely Mali -- and then of course
>>>the French are not quite as respectful as I'd like them to be... oh, and
>>>Yemen and Ireland.
>>>And the Basques, they sure have it coming, as well.
>>>Maybe Germany, while we are at it, just a preemptive thing, of course...and
>>>Berkeley. Hmmm, this has all kinds of possibilities. Maybe the US could
>>>up a lottery, to determine which country gets it next.
>>If we wind up tangling with Iraq again, hopefully that will be it for major
>>military campaigns. Other terrorist harboring states might eventually become
>>a consideration, though maybe minor special operations missions would
>>suffice. As long as Hussein is in power, it seems we will need a continued
>>presence in Saudi. Ousting him could allow us to eventually remove our
>>troops, so it doesn't become another long-term South Korea type occupation.
>>Did you notice that I said we should try giving Iran a second chance,
>>opening relations with them, long severed after they took some of our people
>>Oh, and I don't know if one could say we've targeted Afghanistan *per se*
>>since we are working in cahoots with mujahideen against the Taliban and Al
>>Quaeda. I'd like to see Afghanistan rise like a phoenix from the ashes of
>>all the fighting they've seen over the years with Soviet occupation and the
>>recent struggle over there. Maybe I'm too optimistic though.
>>> > -----Original Message-----
>>> > From: email@example.com [mailto:firstname.lastname@example.org]On Behalf
>>> > Of Scott Chase
>>> > Sent: Friday, December 14, 2001 12:18 PM
>>> > To: email@example.com
>>> > Subject: conditional support for war on Iraq
>>> > If Bush et al decide, upon reasonable closure in the Afghanistan
>>> > where the Al Quaeda are eliminated and an interim government put
>>> > forth with
>>> > the objective of bringing the ethnic factions together under one
>>> > umbrella,
>>> > and with clear objectives in mind for a campaign in Iraq, I would not be
>>> > opposed.
>>> > This campaign need not be immediate nor a full scale war, though I'm not
>>> > eliminating this possibility. Forces should be amassed and ultimatums
>>> > issued. There should be full inspections allowed throughout Iraq for
>>> > whatever nefarious weapons programs Hussein might be backing.
>>> > Failing this,
>>> > the time for action will be obvious and hopefully our allies
>>> > support us. The
>>> > thorn in our side which has been festering all this time should
>>> > be removed
>>> > before it becomes too infectious to deal with in the future. Once
>>> > closure is
>>> > achieved conditions allowing the facilitation of a more friendly
>>> > government
>>> > in Iraq ready to be embraced by the community of the world should
>>> > be put in
>>> > place. Old wounds should be healed and the Iraqi people helped to
>>> > get back
>>> > on their feet.
>>> > Upon closure in Iraq, the U.S. should plan on finally ending our
>>> > presence in Saudi Arabia, ironically one of the issues that got bin
>>> > all hot and bothered. Hopefully we can open relations with Iran,
>>> > which has
>>> > appeared to be a little less hostile, and give them a second
>>> > chance, if our
>>> > campaign in neighboring Iraq doesn't alienate them.
>>> > If we have clear objectives set forth, failing stronger
>>> > diplomatic pressures
>>> > working beforehand, and a definite exit plan upon closure, I think I can
>>> > support military action in Iraq.
>>> > It's time to nip the problems in the bud before they become even
>>> > worse and
>>> > harder to manage later on in the ballgame. While we have
>>> > momentum, we might
>>> > as well get it over with.
>>> > _________________________________________________________________
>>> > Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: http://messenger.msn.com
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>>This was distributed via the memetics list associated with the
>>Journal of Memetics - Evolutionary Models of Information Transmission
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>This was distributed via the memetics list associated with the
>Journal of Memetics - Evolutionary Models of Information Transmission
>For information about the journal and the list (e.g. unsubscribing)
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