Re: A Question for Wade

From: Scott Chase (
Date: Mon Nov 26 2001 - 23:58:18 GMT

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    From: "Scott Chase" <>
    Subject: Re: A Question for Wade
    Date: Mon, 26 Nov 2001 18:58:18 -0500
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    >From: "Joe Dees" <>
    >Subject: Re: A Question for Wade
    >Date: Sun, 25 Nov 2001 14:48:44 -0800
    > > Re: A Question for WadeDate: Sun, 25 Nov 2001 14:32:16 -0500
    > > "Wade T.Smith" <> "Memetics Discussion List"
    > >
    > >Hi Scott Chase -
    > >
    > >>What's so special about the "meme" term? Why can't we just use "idea",
    > >>"belief", or "concept" to say the same thing? As Ernst Mayr says of the
    > >>meme:
    > >>
    > >>(bq) "It seems to me that this word is nothing but an unnecessary
    >synonym of
    > >>the term "concept"." (eq)
    > >
    > >All of which and thus forced me to reconstruct my own thinking and remove
    > >all farce. The meme is a cultural artifact. Any other usage is erroneous
    > >and multiplicative.
    > >
    > Memes are not things, but meaningful patterns in which matter/energy
    >is arranged. This is true whether we are talking about the meaningful
    >sound patterns in which air is arranged to enunciate words, the meaningful
    >geometrical patterns in which ink or pixels or pencil lead are arranged to
    >write them, the meaningful action patterns out bodies enact in order to
    >type or write or speak them, or the meaningful neuron/synapse activation
    >patterns in which such representations are stored in our brains.
    Did you catch my question to you where I asked what the difference between
    your beloved L-meme and a mnemon, the latter term actually used by Lynch
    himself, though independent of Young and Cherkin? What's your opinion of
    Lynch saying on his website ( that the term
    "meme" is expendable? If we are talking about internal neural
    representations related to memory storage there are terms with longer
    pedigrees IMO.
    >The selfsame meme, say, the idea that memes don't exist, may be represented
    >in all of these differing media, and yet be the same meme, for what is
    >constant is not the pattern itself (example: different languages), since a
    >meme may be represented in many different ways in any particular medium,
    >and may be represented in many different media, but the connection between
    >the patterns, as differing representamens, and the idea or concept, as
    >referent. To say that these representati!
    >ons exist (as they obviously do), and that they MEAN the same thing, and
    >then to maintain that they possess no common referent, makes no logical
    >sense to me.

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