Re: state of memes

From: Kenneth Van Oost (
Date: Sat Sep 29 2001 - 12:05:02 BST

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    From: "Kenneth Van Oost" <>
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    Subject: Re: state of memes
    Date: Sat, 29 Sep 2001 13:05:02 +0200
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    ----- Original Message -----
    From: Scott Chase <>
    > I've no major qualms about an elaborate missile defense network. I'm still
    > quite concerned about China and about states such as North Korea which
    > eventually launch an attack as far away as the Pacific seaboard of the
    > The technological spin-offs (serendipity?) of such an undertaking could
    > carry over into non-military realms. My major problem is with the price
    > I've also got issues with irresponsible tax cuts being enacted during the
    > same period of time there's an expensive military build-up. A missile
    > defense network won't prevent domestic terrorism but it could curtail long
    > range engagements.

    Hi Scott,

    I don 't know but from my POV you are missing an important part of the
    equation here !
    I understand your concerns about what Bush is planning to secure the
    US, but don 't you think that beneath the reason of security there are
    lying others, more important ones !? The ones that now pop up in every
    American his/ her mind !? That in a way, you already answered the WHY
    question, in your mind !?

    Why would you be afraid of China and of North- Korea if not you
    have reasons to believe you do !? You think that the American culture
    is thé culture and you enforced this view upon others. But like Islam
    your proud turned into arrogance. It goes wrong when you connect
    a beliefsystem onto politics. The US beliefs strongly in democracy,
    freedom, humanrights, equality, etc ... but not all do the same.
    They do, but not the American- style.

    Values of freedom and equality are rightly fundamental basisblocks
    of our society, but concepts like zero- tolerance undermine the thought
    of freedom itself. Don 't forget, the US is built upon slavery, those
    thoughts and what kind of behaviorcharacteristics did lead from there
    are still in place.

    Like I did mention earlier on this list, the US, Islam, Europe and all
    others are fixed in the way they all think_ memetic determinism
    is according to the views of Huntington a direct result of our various
    ethocentric civilizations. Each block, West, Islam,...has it very own
    cultural habits to perform. We, the West with our technological
    development goes mush faster than the rest, but we have to act so
    that we " protect " the others.

    That is something we cannot do, our memetic determinism implies
    a necessity to " destroy " others, to " steal " from them, to enforce
    our views upon them so that we can go on.
    The solution would be of course, that we take the others into our
    account and help them to develop further. But, again, memetical
    we are blocked to do that. Such ideas are ' Green ' ones, are anti-
    globalist- ones and those will not do.

    In a way, giving in on the anti- globalist movement would be taking
    one step back and we wan' t above all to go one step beyond the
    limits we all know now. The results are quite explosive, literally.
    From our point of view, bringing for example black Africa upon
    the rate of development as we know it, would be catastrofical
    for the worlds environment. That is what we think !
    But does it !? Yes, if we take our numbers into account, but do have
    impartial numbers to back up another view !? No !!

    That is what I mean. We need not to change the world, not the exterior
    factors but we need to change the interior.
    Again, that is a " Green "-peace- view, not an one I very like, but
    we have to make another step for a higher development. Now we are
    stuck on our well known certain level, we need to go beyond that.



    ( I am, because we are) the way we think

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