Re: state of memes

From: Kenneth Van Oost (Kenneth.Van.Oost@village.uunet.be)
Date: Fri Sep 28 2001 - 11:47:42 BST

  • Next message: Vincent Campbell: "RE: state of memes"

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    From: "Kenneth Van Oost" <Kenneth.Van.Oost@village.uunet.be>
    To: <memetics@mmu.ac.uk>
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    Subject: Re: state of memes
    Date: Fri, 28 Sep 2001 12:47:42 +0200
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    ----- Original Message -----
    From: Scott Chase <ecphoric@hotmail.com>
    To: <memetics@mmu.ac.uk>
    > Well the why question isn't too hard.
    > Aside from casuistric implications resulting from anti-Soviet policies
    > whereby the U.S. played a hand in aiding the mujahideen and how this may
    > have helped facilitate the emergence of some of the terrorist networks now
    > seen across the globe, I think that may about exhaust the *why* unless
    > someone feels like delving into the history of jihad into medieval Spain
    and
    > the crusades.

    Hi Scott,

    I saw that coming !!
    You are right of course to mention that the US helped to free Kuwait and
    helped IsraŽl of getting destroyed. But what the US missed, and I ain 't
    gonna say completely, that it put somebody 's back up !
    The US went in, not to free Kuwait but to destroy Saddam !
    That were two different things, and again, like I said in my latest post to
    Lawrence, the Islamitic world did not understand this. And right they were,
    because in this case they were not wrong.

    But on the other hand, the Islamitic world had to understand that the
    question of the Kuwait government for help from the US was legitimate.
    If, the Islamitic world don 't see this as such, well 1_ they don 't really
    care what happens to Kuwait and 2_ they were afraid of Saddam.
    Either way, the Islamitic world did nothing to help Kuwait and thus has
    no reasons to be angry with the US.

    If the Islamitic world is angry with the US just due to the fact that non-
    believers did trespass the Holy cities and sites well shoot me... I can 't
    remerber how many churches and mosks I entered as a non- believer.
    That is childish behavior and shows how very deep in their infancy, to
    understand this things, they are.

    Cultural blocks in order to survive need to evolve along the pyramid of
    development, they need to evolve political, social, cultural, religiously
    and
    memetically to sort things out. Islam, so it seems did not evolve along
    the same way as we did. Is that a shame, their fault !?
    No, by no means, but we, the West want to proceed forwards, Islam is not up
    to such a contest and that fact plays tricks on them.

    That fact is explained by guys like Bin Laden, Khomeini, Saddam, etc as
    certain attacks on Islam. In a way, Islam is blocking us the way to evolve
    further, we want them out of the way.
    Islam understands this not corectly and I agree, sometimes we can do it
    more subtle...we need like I said, help Islam in their conquest to evolve,
    but that must not be seen as interference.

    And of course you are right to mention the crusades, the US has nothing
    to do with those. Europe, and especially Christianity is to blame. 100% !!
    But somehow, memetically speaking we ' forgot ' this, somehow the aid,
    the help we give now to some Islamitic countries is as a compentation for
    the attrocities done then. I agree, that is not the right way, even the Pope
    didn 't want to give excuses for what religion did over there.
    You see, it is not so simple. But remerber, the Islamitic world is not yet
    forgotten the crusades. One of the reasons why they hate us so mush is
    due to that fact.
    Maybe it is time to leave this things behind us and start with a fresh
    blade....

    IMO, the ultimate WHY question can 't be asked and can 't be answered
    without a full understanding of history... we need to meet eachother half-
    way.....

    Best regards,

    Kenneth

    ( I am ,because we are) on whatever level you look

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