RE: memetics-digest V1 #686

From: Vincent Campbell (
Date: Fri Jun 22 2001 - 12:25:03 BST

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    Subject: RE: memetics-digest V1 #686
    Date: Fri, 22 Jun 2001 12:25:03 +0100
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    The trouble is that people who believe themselves to be martyrs are rarely
    defined that way by others- do most Americans tink of Tim McVeigh as a
    martyr (which is clearly why he was happy to be executed)? True martyrs are
    those who die in an apparently selfless manner- they are thinking of others
    not themselves, and thus martyrdom is bestowed upon them by their survivors
    (e.g. Joan of Arc I suppose).

    Is martyrdom copied/imitated? Surely it would need to be in order to be


    > ----------
    > From:
    > Reply To:
    > Sent: Thursday, June 21, 2001 8:29 pm
    > To:
    > Subject: Re: memetics-digest V1 #686
    > This line of thought considering martyrdom makes me wonder about what we
    > might think of as the symbiotic relationships between emotional states
    > with
    > memeplexes. For instance certain categories of memes may have evolved in
    > the
    > context of triggering certain emotional states that serve the memes'
    > competition for mind space. The extreme emotional state of a martyr is
    > probably consciously expereinced in the context of a community (either
    > physical or metaphysical) of which the martyr is a part. My guess is that
    > it
    > taps in to some hardwiring that is associated with parental protection of
    > offspring, even at their own expense. The parents sense of "self" is
    > extended
    > to the offspring so that self destruction to insure the survival of the
    > offspring works. It could be that this parental programing around this
    > extended sense of self is expanded to a even larger sense of self that is
    > associated with a community with which they profoundly identify. And
    > superordinant to the biology all of this is actually inservice to
    > preservation of memeplexes.
    > This line of thought also lead me to wonder is there is a category of
    > memes
    > that might be considered "memeplex busters". Something akin to lightening
    > that starts forest fires that are a part of an evolving biome.
    > Joe

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