Re: New Memes Book

From: Kenneth Van Oost (
Date: Sun 20 Mar 2005 - 11:09:43 GMT

  • Next message: Kate Distin: "Re: New Memes Book"

    ----- Original Message ----- From: Kate Distin <> You wrote,
    > I want to say yes, but I'm hesitating because I'm not absolutely clear
    > what you mean by "realization" in this context. In my book I have
    > talked about memetic representations being realized in different media
    > (these words can be realized on a computer screen, on a paper print-out,
    > orally, etc.) - so it feels a bit odd for me to say that realizations
    > aren't memes.
    > I suspect that this is just a symptom of Philosopher's Pedantry, but to
    > clarify: I would say a spoked wheel is a phenotypic effect of a meme -
    > it is a thing rather than a representation of a thing. I think that
    > does make my answer "yes", but let me know!


    But to get a clear cut of what is the representation of the thing, don 't you need the ' pre- existing- info ' about the thing, whatever that might be, to call what you set under your car ' representations of round things '
    !? That spoked wheels are phenotypic effects of a lot of memes, ok, but ain 't got the ' form ' additional ( memetical) info in itself !? And do possess thus, in that respect spoked wheels not ' memes ' !?

    Spoked wheels can surely be seen as being realizations, technological that is, but from my POV they are also representations. We had here in Belgium about 25 years ago a hype about a certain type of vest, called Millet. Very expensive stuff.

    Those, were ' realized ' I presume in the same way other jackets were fabricated, but what they represented was totally different. They stood for richness of those who wore them; they stood for a kind of sub- cultural aspect of our schooldays; we were somewhat puzzled by them ( what made them so special); they were even the reason why kids stole them. The memes we got in those days about those jackets were trigged by what they ' represent ' not merely why and how they were ' realized '.

    Wear Armani or Lagerfeld, sprinkle yourself with Chanel 5 and people will get a different idea about you. Maybe you ' realize ' in wearing the stuff a certain aspect of your perso- nality, but what they ' represent ' will be, for others, more important.

    So wearing Armani is ' not ' the phenotypic effect of the memes for wearing Armani. This is not in itself memetic, but what wearing Armani
    ' represent ' is !? Do I get it right !?



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