Re: Individual - Collective / digest V1#1480

From: Van oost Kenneth (
Date: Thu 26 Feb 2004 - 20:24:10 GMT

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    ----- Original Message ----- From: "Scott Chase" <>
    > My "dialogue" with sociology is currently limited to a couple crusty
    > who probably aren't all that relevant nowadays, especially Lucien
    > Levy-Bruhl. His _How Natives Think_ might be a bit archaic (and
    > ethnocentric) by today's standards. He does start off, though, by saying
    > (page 13) that collective representations (my current idee fixe) are
    > to the members of a given social group" and "transmitted from one
    > to another".............[ and thus NOT for the whole of the population as
    such] My adding ( Kenneth)


    Because, the above would appear as one and each social class/ cultural group has its own peculiar/ corporate ' world view ', accordingly represented by
    ' greeded ' upon collective representations_ and moreover, their existence would directly be expressed and by their own living conditions and by the material conditions associated with the conceptual view of their ' world '.

    That does indeed mean that each and every (sub)- class/ cultural group has its own memetic determinants. In regard, what thus is seen as group- evolu- tion [ and thus what is being ' natural ' selected] is just an imprint of one group 's dominance, imposing it view on the whole of social/ cultural evolu- tion. That simplifies much the concept of which evolution is being measured, but it is not what ' evolves '.

    Memetic evolution expresses less the way any class/ group lives its con- ditions of existence [ it does as a sub- class] but is more a way of showing how those live in relation to the lived experience of other classes/ groups. Memetic evolution as such within the group/ class itself runs against its own back, because as in their minds as in their lives they don 't get beyond the limits of their own group/ class.

    This is in fact a vicious circle, ' cause certain barriers in society as in the mind baffle and twart transformation/ new ideas. The many in memetics,
    [ where they are caught with I don 't care] need to think ' memetically ', and not in analogy with...., or being tempted to elevate their own private expertise....We need, for starters, our own angle of incidence [ computer, sociobiology, psychology,...] and from there working our way thru ' the field.


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