From: Reed Konsler (
Date: Thu 22 May 2003 - 18:49:50 GMT

  • Next message: Van oost Kenneth: "Re: memetics-digest V1 #1350"

    "The venue is not only the space in which the performance takes place, but the time in which it does."

    OK, I'll agree, a performance requires a unit of space-time in which to occur.

    "and it is not only the time and the place, but the commanded aspects of allowance for the performance. It is both history and continuance."

    All of that is in the brains of the participants. The physical props do not command or expect anything. Does a broom expect to sweep? Does it get frustrated if it doesn't of confused if it is danced with instead?

    "It is the very ground upon which the performer and the observer stand."

    If you mean that in a concrete way, it's just a prop. If you mean that in an abstract way, the information making up the "ground" is recorded in the minds of the participants.

    "It is not absent, or unnecessary, and every single memeinthemind model, including yours, has attempted to dismiss it."

    I'm not saying it is absent, or unnecessary, or dismissing it. I'm saying the irreducible, necessary part of the venue is physically located in the brain. I will agree that there must be some unit of space-time...some media...for a performance to occur within. But, after the performance has occurred, that media is neither necessary nor sufficient to "maintain" the pre-performance. The mechanism that leads from one performance to another requires, and only requires, a single human brain. Everything else is just a prop.

    > Memes are small units and probably can't replicate any
    > more than a particular gene can. A virus is a collection large and
    > complex
    > enough to cause the host to express a performance.

    Wade: Did you really mean to say this? Is this not a radical departure, both in methodology and definition?

    I don't think so. I got the distinction from _Virus of the Mind_ : a very elegant, succinct, and practical description of memetics, written by a very intelligent, caring person. I recommend it to people whenever it seems appropriate. Sometimes even when it doesn't. It seems I can't help myself. Must be good memes.



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