Re: Hello, can anyone help?

From: Van oost Kenneth (
Date: Sun 16 Feb 2003 - 15:50:53 GMT

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    I forgot to give the URL,

    You can link on from there....

      ----- Original Message -----
      From: Van oost Kenneth
      Sent: Sunday, February 16, 2003 4:22 PM
      Subject: Re: Hello, can anyone help?

      Hi Martha,

      At least from my ' over the big water- view ' an interesting site is the one of
      the Vernon Johns Society, where the next can be found,

      " Ending American Moralism: a non moralistic approach to deviancy "

      It stresses (the) reason(s) why in America God and Creatonism are still
      major players within society and thought_ and why thus you and your
      bosses differ in meaning.


        ----- Original Message -----
        From: Martha Granger
        Sent: Friday, February 14, 2003 3:56 PM
        Subject: Hello, can anyone help?

        I joined this group a couple of months ago, and I am certainly no expert, nor have I even studied memetics. I think I found this group when I was searching for sites and information about how Christianity started or evolved into what it has become because I am currently living in such a "bible-istic" area.. although isn't most of the USA that way? As a matter of fact, when I found your group was the moment I first learned of the word "memetics." A lot of what I have read here in the past has lead me to believe I in no way am qualified to belong here, a lot of it seems over my head. I've remained enlisted in this group, but have kept quiet until now.
        Recent postings have caught my attention, as they relate to religion.
        A few days ago, I got into a "discussion" with my boss (and friend) regarding Christianity. He and his wife (his wife is also a boss of mine in the small company I work for) are such the devout Baptists. JC, the company president is quite the "know-it-all." They of course, want me to be "saved" and seem to believe that if I would just read the bible, that I would realize that it is indeed "the greatest book in the world" and that I will become a Christian. Whatever.. He believes that anyone who is not "saved" will go to "hell" (me), and he, of course, will go to "heaven." He told me that he has read several books on religion, including the Qurah (sp?) and translations of old original texts and has come to this conclusion on his own that Christian is the only way to be.
        However, my boss did make an offer that I just may take him up on! He told me that he would read 10 books of my choosing if only I would read the bible! Hmm... that would take quite a bit of patience on my part. It also would be a big undertaking for me, as I would wish to point out stupidity and errors of the bible and present him with a composition at completion. I really don't know if it is worth all of that time on my part, as he is such a strong believer. I think he could somehow "argue away" any book I could happen to come up with for his reading.
        I would surely appreciate any insite that anyone here could provide to me. It certainly seems that most or all who are part of this list are quite studied and intelligent. Perhaps you can recommend books that I can present to him? Or perhaps you will tell me it is of no use wasting my time reading and studying the bible, as there is no way to convince him of his brainwashing, no matter what books I give him. You may email me directly if you believe this does not pertain to the purpose of the list.
        Thank you in advance for any insite anyone can provide,
        Martha (a computer programmer/analyst in Bible-country, Indiana, U.S.A.)

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