Fw: Why Europe is so Contrary (joe 2)

From: Van oost Kenneth (kennethvanoost@belgacom.net)
Date: Tue 03 Dec 2002 - 20:45:40 GMT

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    > Kenneth,
    > > > Where is your trust !? Your commitment !? You place upon yourself
    > a hard burden you can 't no longer bear. Everywhere you see enemies and
    > possible threats, that's no life man !
    > Joe,
    > > We are bearing not only our own burdens, but yours as well, which we
    > > would not feel compelled to do if you would just bear them yourself.
    > > And the threat is to the entire Dar al Harb, that is, any government not
    > > submitting its entire populace to shari'a law. You will realize that
    > > enough through the actions of Radical Islamofascists; it has been
    > > already widely advetized through their words.
    > But that ain 't something I asked you to do ! You think you are in the
    > place to do it out of yourself, be my guest !
    > Kaplan mentioned this in the essay you provided us, I understand that the
    > US uses its military power to settle conflicts if their own interests are
    > stake or if a country asks for it, but you never gonna hear me say that
    > US
    > does this out of a kind of idealism... that is altruistic behavior and
    > ain 't
    > gonna work on such a massive scale ! I mentioned this before, I believe,
    > this is so, than it is something thicker than your blood, than I would/
    > could
    > understand it, but not out the notion of " we have the power lets use it "
    > The US never allowed Russia to " use its power ", you always obstructed
    > it where you could and IMO still does, that ain 't idealism, that is
    > enforce-
    > ment, these are blind ideological moves.
    > And by the way, Kaplan is biased, there ain 't objectivity, he is walking
    > the
    > American walk. His point of origin in the ways he thinks is
    > of a country, " and the country that must be preserved, is America " he
    > writes.
    > If you don 't hear that within that notion the preservation of the US
    > implies
    > that possible others countries have to go, well than I don 't really
    > undestand.
    > I am sorry, but I always thought that novels and stories about chivalry
    > out of date, but when Kaplan begins to say ( in the interview I got) that
    > bases himself upon the thoughts of Machiavelli where ' virtue ' means '
    > courage ',
    > energy, knowledge, bravery and sharpwittness or in other words, manly
    > than I see again the US as Don Quichot in the Man of the la Mancha,
    > windmills.
    > Kenneth
    > > > Again Joe, I detect something of a disapproval for European ways of
    > > > handling things, again you seem to indicate you 're right and we 're
    > > > wrong ! I don 't know who said this but eventually this will tear us
    > > > apart, the isolation where the US holds itself in, will fall down on
    > > > itself.
    > Joe,
    > > Actually, that is because you are as wrong to ignore or dismiss this
    > > threat as Chamberlain was to ignore another less religious fascist
    > > 60+ years ago. Your very lack of resolve in demanding that all citizens
    > > of a country respect its laws, including those that demand tolerance for
    > > others, is perceived by such people as a weakness to be exploited, and
    > > exploit it they will.
    > If this is so, than it can means only two things, in Europe we're all
    > memetical
    > blind and I wonder how that came about_ in what way we' re rocked to sleep
    > !?
    > On the other hand than ' knows ' the US something more, something we
    > singly ignore_ and in the same token I wonder !
    > In a sense, what America does can be again that religious fact where I
    > har-
    > ping about, the notion that the US wants to clear up what can be defined
    > the
    > " irrationality of man "_ again, the notion of the Lamarckian creation is
    > not far away....
    > And, Kaplan writes, " in politics we deal with people who lack rationality
    > ".
    > Joe,
    > > I have given a good deal of thought to Europe's reluctance to face up to
    > > their own problems, and instead dump them in the US's lap by default,
    > > all the while dissing, downing and deploring the US while the US is
    > > busy dealing with those very problems for a Europe reticent about
    > > taking care of what by all rights should be their own business. It is a
    > > sad situation, and Europe needs to take responsibility for themselves
    > > more and criticize the US less when it feels obligated, by it's sense of
    > > responsibility for an ally, Europe, that continuously demonstrates a
    > > of will to recognize and deal with its own problems, to deal with them
    > > it. If you won't or can't deal with your own problems, and they
    > > nevertheless must be dealt with for the global good, it would be nice
    > > to be raked over the coals for our blood-and-treasure-expensive loyalty,
    > > magnanimity, largesse and noblesse oblige.
    > Again why is it than so important to the US to stick around !?
    > I don 't believe that it is out the kind of idealism that Kaplan talks
    > !
    > There has to be a catch somewhere, if not self- interest, what can it be
    > Kaplan writes in that regard, " By the way, democracies can become
    > dictotarial too. The possibility to move armed forces around the globe
    > scoops out American politics. "
    > What it means IMO is that the US always will return to its military
    > power, necessary or not, you got it, you will use, even when the force don
    > 't
    > stand in proportion to what really happened. There ain 't room for de-
    > mocratic discours something where the US is so proud of... strange, again
    > > >
    > Kenneth

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