Re: Regarding MEMRI

From: Scott Chase (
Date: Sun 24 Nov 2002 - 16:18:34 GMT

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    >From: Jeremy Bradley <>
    >Subject: Re: Regarding MEMRI
    >Date: Sun, 24 Nov 2002 21:56:34 +1100
    >At 07:11 PM 23/11/02 -0600, you wrote:
    > >I respect Chomsky's opinions on these issues little more than I respect
    > >those of Robert Fisk or Edward Said. What might trouble such types
    > >about MEMRI (the Middle East Media Research Institute) is that they
    > >present information and opinions that conflict with the schema which the
    > >above authors proffer, but which they cannot refute, for what they
    > >present are the horse's mouth messages of the Muslim government
    > >officials, media outlets and mullahs themselves, and although they
    > >might like to kill this translating messenger, the messages are
    > >authentic, authentically translated, and their sources are voluminously
    > >documented.
    > >
    >Sure buddy, but why did you not address the four criteria for peace as
    >reported (quite simply) by the Arabic News (all you did was to denigrate
    >Egyptian media integrity out of hand). They are the genuine concerns of the
    >majority of ME peoples. Let me refresh your memory.
    >"Al-Baz set out a number of conditions that needed to be met by Israel so
    >as to enjoy peace with its Arab neighbors. He said that foremost of all
    >conditions was Israel's renouncement of all its expansionist schemes and
    >its dumping of the theory of stretching its land from the Nile to the
    >Al-Baz prodded Israel to dismantle its military nuclear program noting that
    >it (Israel) should not expect to establish a durable peace with its
    >neighbors so long as it continued to possess nuclear weapons.
    >Israel must stop its settlement building and commit itself to a declared
    >timetable to withdraw from the occupied lands, he said."
    >That is all Joe. What is so hard about renouncing its plans for an Israeli
    >Super-State, giving up its WMDs, stop building settlements on acknowledged
    >Palestinian land and committing to an autonomous Palestinian State; after
    >all that's mostly what the UN has repeatedly directed Israel to do.
    >The only alternative to these requests is to relocate or kill the entire
    >Palestinian population; an alternative which is not out of the question for
    >some radical Zionist fundamentalists.
    >I read what you post and try to comment on it, as well as my typing speed
    >allows. So come on tell me why you wouldn't support these four peace
    >initiatives when the obvious alternative is constant war. What is so hard
    >about telling Zion to back off?
    First off, I had heard of the Nile to Euphrates expansion notion before, but can't recall exactly where. I don't think that a modern view of Greater Israel for the Revisionsts goes that far and maybe it has become somewhat of a canard hoisted by the Arabs. The Greater Israel expansionists may be more interested merely in the West Bank (including Judea and Samaria). Interest in the Gaza strip could be more strategic than ideological. Remember that a Revisionist named Begin was on the Israeli side of negotiations with Egypt for renouncing claims on the Sinai (to the chagrin of some settlers that IIRC Arik himself wound up having to remove).

    The early Revisionist Zionists were IIRC miffed by Britain's carving the formerly larger Palestine mandate into Palestine and Transjordan. They, I think, wanted the East Bank too. OTOH those on the Labor side were happy with the smaller state represented by UN res 181 (unlike the obstinate Revisionists and the rejectionists on the Arab side). It could be argued that the smaller state was seen as a stepping stone for further gradualist expansion (as opposed to the saltationist Revisionist tendency). The descendants of Labor Zionism these days would probably me more likely to negotiate land for peace and allow emergence of a Palestinian state, given the satisfaction of some hoop jumping on the Palestinian side which would demonstrate their committment to a truly peaceful resolution.

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