From: Scott Chase (email@example.com)
Date: Sun 24 Nov 2002 - 00:09:08 GMT
>From: "Lawrence DeBivort" <firstname.lastname@example.org>
>Subject: RE: Islam and Europe and the Palestinians and the Left and the
>anti-Americans and Joe
>Date: Sat, 23 Nov 2002 16:31:47 -0500
>Joe is at it again...now focusing his diatribe on the Palestinians. The
>Palestinians, you see, in Joe's world, abandoned their homes voluntarily.
>They were really happy, Joe will tell us, to give their lands and homes and
>political existence to the Israelis. There was of course no such thing as
>the Dar Yassin massacres, in Joe's particular worldview. There was no such
>thing as the refusal to allow the Palestinians to return to their country
>homes. In later emails, Joe will also probably tell us that the
>Palestinians who did manage to remain in the territories taken by Israel
>live as full citizens of Israel, and not as second-class citizens, whose
>homes are subject to unilateral forfeiture whenever Israel wants them.
>Really, when you get right down to it in Joe's worldview, the Palestinians
>have no reason at all to be waging a war against Israel. They are, Joe will
>tell us, just plain old anti-Jewish and tools of the world-wide
>cannibalistic memetic Muslim something or other...
I've got issues with the way Palestinians have fared in the Occupied Territories and with Israeli policies that seem to impede the peace process and have reservations about Arik (though I reserve my opinion about him on the darker side of the actions in Beirut which were carried out by Christian Phalangists) and his present belligerence, but all this being said, suicide bombings are the most atrocious thing going on right now in that conflict.
>Now Joe will run off to his true-blue websites (the more anonymous or
>bigoted or self-serving the better!) and conjure up another round of bit
>extractions from reality, with which Joe populates his worldview.
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: email@example.com [mailto:firstname.lastname@example.org]On Behalf
> > Of email@example.com
> > Sent: Saturday, November 23, 2002 4:06 PM
> > To: firstname.lastname@example.org
> > Subject: RE: Islam and Europe and Joe
> > > At 12:40 PM 23/11/02 -0600, you wrote:
> > > >> At 12:37 PM 22/11/02 -0500, you wrote:
> > > >> >
> > > >> >Hi, Scott,
> > > >> >By 'anti-Semitic' I mean bigoted against any or all Semitic races,
> > > >> >including Arabs. Islam, being a religion, would not be included,
> > > >> >though of course many Muslims are Arabs and vice versa. My
> > > >> >experience of bigots is that their bigotry can swing around at
> > > >> >anytime to attack anyone who is 'different,' so it should not
> > > >> >bring much comfort to Jews - or anyone else - that Joe has so far
> > > >> >focused his anti-Semitism on Arabs and Muslims.
> > > >>
> > > >> I think that we need to separate Zionism, (an aggressive political
> > > >> position which supports the creation of the Greater Israeli State,
> > > >> genocide and ethnic cleansing), Judaism (the religion) and Jews
> > > >> (the Jewish people). The area of land claimed by Zion is that which
> > > >> was 'given' to Abraham and his descendants by his God in a
> > > >> 'vision'. I've always thought that it was fairly suspect land deal
> > > >> (no witnesses). See Gen. 15: 18-21. Personally I don't mind Judaism
> > > >> or Jews but I think that the US backed Zionist movement is the most
> > > >> dangerous political force in the World today. <snip>
> > > >>
> > > >I must disagree with you, and so must most of the non-Muslim world.
> > > >The most dangerous political force in the world today, wreaking havoc
> > > > and terror across the globe from Bali to Kashmir to Jerusalem to New
> > > > York, is undoubtedly the memeset of Radical Islam.
> > > >>
> > > Joe as I read it, even Osama was reacting against US/Israeli
> > > persecution and expansionism.
> > >
> > Actually, what originally pissed him off was the Saudi family blowing
> > his offer for his four thousand (at the time) mujaheddin to defend Saudi
> > Arabia in a jihad against Iraq before the start of the Gulf War twelve
> > years ago, and instead bringing in the disgusting, hated, despised,
> > Godless infidel unbeliever US to defend the holy Mecca and Medina,
> > and sully the sacred soil of the Muslim Holy Sand.
> > He used his other two points - the Palestinian situation and a later
> > inverted sympathy for the very Iraq he offered to fight - as ways to
> > gullible jihadist wannabees into making the commitment to join his
> > army.
> > >
> > >I have not read anywhere that he was
> > > attempting to convert the world to Islam - as you keep saying. The
> > > requests from most of the Muslim world are as stated by Al Baz in the
> > > piece that I sent you. If those four conditions were met the
> > > Islamofasists, as you name them rightly, would have no more support
> > > base than the KKK has in Christendom. The problem is the aggressive
> > > Zionist expansionism.
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>Journal of Memetics - Evolutionary Models of Information Transmission
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