From: Grant Callaghan (email@example.com)
Date: Tue 19 Nov 2002 - 03:32:50 GMT
>Date: Mon, 18 Nov 2002 21:54:56 -0500
>>From: "Grant Callaghan" <firstname.lastname@example.org>
>>Subject: RE: Why Europe is so Contrary
>>Date: Mon, 18 Nov 2002 17:42:10 -0800
>>And let's not forget what Napoleon did for the world in the name of
>>France. And what Hitler did for France in the name of Germany. Oh,
>>there's lots of room for finger pointing and cries of imperialism to go
>My main point was that before those from the U.K. and Europe start off on
>any holier than thou tirades against U.S. policy, they should take a closer
>look at their own gov't and their own histories.
>Even though I own a DVD version of Mel Gibson's "The Patriot" and harbor
>some resentment towards them Green Dragoons as depicted in that movie, I've
>no personal beef with the U.K. If I were Irish reflecting on former English
>rule over my island (minus six counties) or an Arab who felt betrayed by
>T.E. Lawrence et al things might be different. If the Brits on the list
>want to ask us about our brutal tactics, policy blunders and false
>promises, they should start looking at their own.
>After watching another Gibson flick "We Were Soldiers" I really started to
>reflect on our policies toward S.E. Asia and why the heck we committed
>troops in Vietnam. That was probably a bad move, though apologists would
>assert that even though we pulled out after all those deaths catalogued on
>the Vietnam memorial, making the stand may have helped in the long run
>(falling dominos and all that crap). BTW, the beginning of that movie shows
>the French involvement that preceded ours. Weren't they having troubles in
>Algeria at roughly the same time?
>"Blackhawk Down" also makes me reflect on futile efforts and crappy U.S.
>foreign policy. Bush Senior left that as a belated Christmas present for
>Clinton. I remember wondering what the heck we were doing getting involved
>in that endeavor and the catastrophe in Mogadishu pretty much sums it up.
>Bad move. BTW weren't the Somalis trained by ObL and his Afghan Arabs?
I believe the Russians also had a go at training the troops in Mogadishu
before we came along and made the mistake of trying to feed them. This
seems to happen more often than I like to think about. We go in and try to
give food to the starving natives and some war lord starts shooting people.
When we fight back, the whole world jumps on our back about our outrageous
behavior in picking on the poor Africans. I've read reporters in Europe who
blamed America for every life lost in Mogadishu during the entire conflict
including those who died of starvation and those who were killed by the
various tribes who were fighting each other. It was all our fault for
trying to bring them food in the first place. That's just the kind of
imperialist policy people are talking about. If we don't help starving
people we're to blame for them starving. If we do help them and have to
protect the food from war lords trying to steal it we're imposing on the
poor natives. Meanwhile the natives are busy killing each other and
mutilating each other over old tribal conflicts that we know nothing about.
Sometimes I think we are naive in trying to help the world at all. Everyone
seems to hate the guy who tries to help. Nobody ever seems able to do it to
the satisfaction of the people being helped. It may be better just to let
them starve or solve their own problems. That may sound callous, but look
at the record of how our past efforts have turned out. I've even read
accounts that blame the U.S. for all the deaths in Kosovo. We did it all
with our bombing raids on the Serb soldiers.
Add photos to your messages with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*.
This was distributed via the memetics list associated with the
Journal of Memetics - Evolutionary Models of Information Transmission
For information about the journal and the list (e.g. unsubscribing)
This archive was generated by hypermail 2.1.5 : Tue 19 Nov 2002 - 03:36:07 GMT