Date: Sun, 27 Sep 1998 19:04:21 +0000
From: Bruce Howlett <bhowlett@metz.une.edu.au>
To: memetics@mmu.ac.uk
Subject: Re: Hosts vs. Instances
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Tim wrote:
<And to be completely honest with you, Aaron, as an unpublished former
college drop-out with an interest in memetics, the prospect of trying to get
my work excepted in a forum such as this, after witnessing all the academic
prejudices displayed by those such as you, is truly less than inspiring to
me at the moment. >
Aaron wrote:
<Tim, I have not even known whether or not you graduated college, or had a
doctorate, let alone shown you prejudice over it. Nor did I show prejudice
against Richard Brodie in early 1994, when I sent him my 1991 Journal of
Ideas article. That paper contains virtually the same set of equations
given in my 1998 JoM-EMIT article. I would have sent the paper to you, too,
had I known of your interest back then.
Nevertheless, it will be difficult for me to consider your mathematical
modeling ideas without seeing your equations. If you do not yet feel like
taking the kind of criticism that I have been getting, then why don't you
put your equations on the web, and announce the URL? A variety of works in
progress have been offered for commentary on the memetics list, and this
can be a useful stage in preparing a paper for journal submission. >
Tim,
Not being an *academic* is a significant advantage in any cutting edge
technology. You have not suffered the brainwashing and probably retain a
creative and unique approach to your work. I consider myself fortunate to have
started my *academic* career at age 44, by which time I was fairly immune to
the *conform or fail mentality* used by most institutions to protect their
conclaves of accepted thinking. I have not embarked on this course for the
questionable glory of academic acceptance or some egocentric desire to change
the world, but simply because I enjoy the challenge and it extends my cognitive
abilities and enriches my life. If by some chance this work eventually enables
new cultures of understanding, then we will have achieved a significant result
for humankind. I will still use some of your work in my thesis and proudly
recognise the source.
The problem with Richard and Aaron is that they fail to recognise that they are
prejudiced, and continue to use their considerable intelligence to defend a
particular stance they perceive to be the only right one. I would counsel a
more cooperative approach with a generous dose of lateral thinking in order to
progress from here. The possibility of a unified theory is probably remote, as
it is for other sciences. Ever the optimist, I would hope that a useful
working model of memetics evolves in the near future. My personal ambition
(for my thesis) is to model change management strategies in local government,
which will include some references to memetics. If I decide to progress the
model, it will include some concepts which I have already raised on this list
such as a *cybermeme* and using memetic constructs to manipulate micro cultures
within organisations. This is the exciting aspect of memetics. Does it matter
how a meme is stored? It could be in cuneiform on a stone tablet or digital
data on a computer. If when the *meme* information is communicated to a human
it penetrates (competes successfully with other memes), is activated (triggered
by pattern identification or by subverting or converting other processes), is
recognised (as a memory object), then replicates (which may include mutation)
by causing the host to pass on the meme in some form; THEN we are talking about
a recogniseable memetic event. There may even be a physiological or
psychological explanation for this phenomena. Regardless of the process, the
validation of memes relies on the discovery of how it works in a *real*
situation, in *real* time, and what *real* effect it has on human behaviour.
The rest is just inventing models and language to adequately describe what is
happening. For some people, the debate is an end product. I would like to
think (considering the fairly large chunks of my life I am committing to this
study), that eventually there will be useful tools and practical applications
for memetics in mainstream society.
Regards,
Bruce.
--
Bruce Howlett. B.A.L., J.P.
Email: bhowlett@metz.une.edu.au
Researching: Management of Change in Organizations: The Culture Concept
at the University of New England
Armidale NSW 2350
AUSTRALIA
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Tim wrote:
<And to be completely honest with you, Aaron, as an unpublished former
college drop-out with an interest in memetics, the prospect of trying
to get
my work excepted in a forum such as this, after witnessing all the
academic
prejudices displayed by those such as you, is truly less than inspiring
to
me at the moment. >
Aaron wrote:
<Tim, I have not even known whether or not you graduated college,
or had a
doctorate, let alone shown you prejudice over it. Nor did I show prejudice
against Richard Brodie in early 1994, when I sent him my 1991 Journal
of
Ideas article. That paper contains virtually the same set of equations
given in my 1998 JoM-EMIT article. I would have sent the paper to you,
too,
had I known of your interest back then.
Nevertheless, it will be difficult for me to consider your mathematical
modeling ideas without seeing your equations. If you do not yet feel
like
taking the kind of criticism that I have been getting, then why don't
you
put your equations on the web, and announce the URL? A variety of works
in
progress have been offered for commentary on the memetics list, and
this
can be a useful stage in preparing a paper for journal submission.
>
Tim,
Not being an *academic* is a significant advantage in any cutting edge technology. You have not suffered the brainwashing and probably retain a creative and unique approach to your work. I consider myself fortunate to have started my *academic* career at age 44, by which time I was fairly immune to the *conform or fail mentality* used by most institutions to protect their conclaves of accepted thinking. I have not embarked on this course for the questionable glory of academic acceptance or some egocentric desire to change the world, but simply because I enjoy the challenge and it extends my cognitive abilities and enriches my life. If by some chance this work eventually enables new cultures of understanding, then we will have achieved a significant result for humankind. I will still use some of your work in my thesis and proudly recognise the source.
The problem with Richard and Aaron is that they fail to recognise that they are prejudiced, and continue to use their considerable intelligence to defend a particular stance they perceive to be the only right one. I would counsel a more cooperative approach with a generous dose of lateral thinking in order to progress from here. The possibility of a unified theory is probably remote, as it is for other sciences. Ever the optimist, I would hope that a useful working model of memetics evolves in the near future. My personal ambition (for my thesis) is to model change management strategies in local government, which will include some references to memetics. If I decide to progress the model, it will include some concepts which I have already raised on this list such as a *cybermeme* and using memetic constructs to manipulate micro cultures within organisations. This is the exciting aspect of memetics. Does it matter how a meme is stored? It could be in cuneiform on a stone tablet or digital data on a computer. If when the *meme* information is communicated to a human it penetrates (competes successfully with other memes), is activated (triggered by pattern identification or by subverting or converting other processes), is recognised (as a memory object), then replicates (which may include mutation) by causing the host to pass on the meme in some form; THEN we are talking about a recogniseable memetic event. There may even be a physiological or psychological explanation for this phenomena. Regardless of the process, the validation of memes relies on the discovery of how it works in a *real* situation, in *real* time, and what *real* effect it has on human behaviour. The rest is just inventing models and language to adequately describe what is happening. For some people, the debate is an end product. I would like to think (considering the fairly large chunks of my life I am committing to this study), that eventually there will be useful tools and practical applications for memetics in mainstream society.
Regards,
Bruce.
--