Date: Tue, 22 Jul 1997 11:51:41 -0700 (PDT)
From: Scott DeLancey <delancey@darkwing.uoregon.edu>
To: memetics@mmu.ac.uk
Subject: Re: Meaning generation
In-Reply-To: <Pine.SUN.3.91.970722024025.694A-100000@utrio.Helsinki.FI>
On Tue, 22 Jul 1997, Martti Nyman wrote:
> Mark Mills to Bill Benzon:
> > starts. She has discovered what one might call the notion that 'things'
> > can be 'symbolized,' and meaning shared.
> >
> > I'm suggesting this 'connection' represents the activation of a meme,
> > something biologically inherited by most humans at conception. There are
> > many other memes, but this one is biological in origin. The activities of
<snip>
> I must admit I have problems with what activation of inherited memes
> is supposed to be about. I doubt that you mean that Helen, like us
> all, had a genetically ready-made concept for 'water'. Do you mean
> that humans, as well as those animals having a more or less instinctive
> attitude to water, have some kind of pre-linguistic primordial
> 'knowledge' of the water element? I'm not sure, but it seems obvious
I choked on this for a minute too, but I think the problem is actually
something different. Mark later says:
> But, we do need to have something internal to make the 'connection.'
> That something is one's biologically granted memetic ability.
Which makes it clear that what he's imputing to genetics is symbolic
ability, not a particular concept. But I do have a problem with Mark's
phrasing:
> There are many other memes, but this one is biological in origin.
In the first place, how does it make sense to talk of a meme which
is genetically defined? All animals have genetically programmed
behavior modules to some degree; what memetics is about is not that,
but the *non-genetic* transmission of behavior patterns. Symbolic
behavior, as Mark suggests, clearly seems to be an evolutionary
adaptation which characterizes the human species; as such, it is not
a meme, but the fundamental characteristic of humans which allows
for the creation and transmission of memes.
Scott DeLancey
Department of Linguistics
University of Oregon
Eugene, OR 97403, USA
delancey@darkwing.uoregon.edu
http://www.uoregon.edu/~delancey/prohp.html
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