Message-Id: <3.0.1.32.19970714000117.006bbafc@popmail.mcs.net>
Date: Mon, 14 Jul 1997 00:01:17 -0500
To: memetics@mmu.ac.uk
From: Aaron Lynch <aaron@mcs.net>
Subject: Re: Genetics/Memetics analogy
In-Reply-To: <199707140350.XAA05970@brickbat8.mindspring.com>
Aaron Lynch responding to Bill Benzon:
>>I genuinely don't see your point Bill. I do not see how we can considere
>>evolution without considering replicators. Nor do I see why a replicator
>>has to be 'tangible'.
>>
>For one, it seems to me that the version of memetics that takes the virus
>as its model is not, in any deep sense, much concerned with cultural
>evolution. It's concerned about catchy memes & that apparent fact that
>many of them seem not to be in the rational interest of their "hosts."
Bill,
I agree that the memetic paradigm need not be invoked to explain all of
cultural evolution. There are simply too many cases where it does not shed
any new light beyond that shed by existing social sciences. But the cases
where memetics DOES shed new light are often quite important.
>As for the tangibility of repicators, I have nothing to say beyond what
>I've already said & have no desire to repeat it here. My complaint about
>memetics is that it treats intangible thoughts as though they were atomic
>units of some sort and as though these intangible units had autonomous
>powers.
The complaint about "tangibility" works just as well against the notion
that there exist "ideas" or "beliefs," or that two people can hold "the
same" idea or belief.
Still, I agree with you that there people who write as though memes were
"atomic," or as if they had autonomous "powers." I believe this has given
you a cross-reacting immunity to more serious works: a kind of vaccination
by prior exposure to weakened strains. See the "Memes: Self-Replicants or
Mysticism?" debate at http://www.wired.com/braintennis/96/43/index0a.html.
>William L. Benzon 201.217.1010
>708 Jersey Ave. Apt. 2A bbenzon@mindspring.com
>Jersey City, NJ 07302 USA http://www.newsavanna.com/wlb/
>
>
>
>
>===============================================================
>This was distributed via the memetics list associated with the
>Journal of Memetics - Evolutionary Models of Information Transmission
>For information about the journal and the list (e.g. unsubscribing)
>see: http://www.cpm.mmu.ac.uk/jom-emit
>
>
----Aaron Lynch
THOUGHT CONTAGION: How Belief Spreads Through Society The New Science of Memes Basic Books. Info and free sample: http://www.mcs.net/~aaron/thoughtcontagion.html
=============================================================== This was distributed via the memetics list associated with the Journal of Memetics - Evolutionary Models of Information Transmission For information about the journal and the list (e.g. unsubscribing) see: http://www.cpm.mmu.ac.uk/jom-emit